WSB AM at night

[jabba17]

WLAC was a viable signal east of the Mississippi except areas that had adjacent channel stations (the old KOMA 1520 Oklahoma City) and KSTP 1500 Twin Cities and the Northeast where it was really hammered by the old 1510 Boston, 1520 Buffalo and 1500 Washington. Plus, and there were more than a few 1490 class C’s that occasionally had a little extra bandwidth.

But if you were Black (or liked blues with some soul mixed in) and lived in the Southeast, and most of the Midwest it was your “station” at night thru the mid 1970’s. They sold a lot of per inquiry merchandise at night.

WLAC is a famous station with a good history, especially with soul/R&B like you said. For some reason, though, when I try to DX it, it comes in very faintly with a lot of RFI, if at all.

 

[jabba17]

In most of the rest of the world (Europe, Asia, Africa) powers up to 2,000,000 watts on Medium Wave (what we incorrectly call "AM" in the Americas) are common, although most such stations are government operated and are slowly disappearing.

Shortwave has two kinds of service: local/regional on frequencies around 6 MHz or below with powers in the 250 watt to 10 kw range usually and international with powers up to a million watts. Most of those are also gone.

Any kind of amplitude modulated radio today is obsolete. It is subject to man-made noise and usually has limited quality compared to FM, HD, DAB, etc. That is why in many nations, from Mexico to Switzerland, "AM" has been eliminated or significantly phased out.

I have a Zenith Trans-Oceanic and it's hard finding anything on shortwave these days, especially from developed countries.

Re: AM, it beats the hell out of "Standard Broadcast", as you often see on old radios.

German radios often referred to FM as UKW (Ultrakurzwelle, or ultra shortwave).

 

[Kent]

IIRC, the FCC did change their rules to allow FM analog translators of HD signals, as well as AM signals. It used to be that you could only have a translator for an FM (analog) signal, and it had to be within the contour of the parent FM. This made it impossible for those wanting to get additional FM analog programming on the air.

When the translator rules were originally established, there was no digital radio. I believe it was Cumulus who actually got the FCC to specify in its translator rules that HD Radio multicast channels could be relayed on FM translators. If I remember correctly, it originally applied to relay 1400 in Harrisburg on one of its translators, I believe 95.3, when the FCC starting allowing AM's to use FM translators on a limited basis. However, it ended up moving the urban AC format on 1400 to an HD subchannel of WNNK 104.1, and that was the programming it had originally wanted to relay on FM. After looking at the FCC rules, it concluded there was no rule against relaying a subchannel. So, it proceeded, and the FCC ultimately codified those rules to say you could use a translator to relay a digital subchannel.

 

[Marcos_C]

The one class A I can't get, for being as close as it is, is WBT. However, it is highly directional at night. WBT-AM Radio Station Coverage Map

I am able to pick up WBT in New York City at night. The reception is variable, ranging from good to barely audible.

As for WSB, I am able to pick it up at night. However, today, reception of WSB is not as good as that of WBT. I have had better success getting better reception of WSB in the past.

 

[BarryATL]

I am able to pick up WBT in New York City at night. The reception is variable, ranging from good to barely audible.

As for WSB, I am able to pick it up at night. However, today, reception of WSB is not as good as that of WBT. I have had better success getting better reception of WSB in the past.

I live near the WSB tower. There are several things working against it. The tower is on the wrong side of the city. The ground conductivity is terrible here anyway (red clay soil), but in that area, there is granite in the ground. If the tower had been put on the other side of Atlanta, it would not have the granite layer in the soil.

Also, 30 years ago they built a shopping center on the tower ground system. Originally, it was state of the art. I am no engineer, but it was explained that all of the building ground systems were tied to the WSB tower ground array. This stopped WSB from coming in on incandescent light bulbs (that really is a thing). Anyway, over the years all of that has aged and not been updated as structures have changed. I am sure the COX side is being kept up to date and in great condition as COX has a long history in Atlanta of having some of the best engineers and are funded..... although, that is probably slowly changing with the new owners.

 

[JoeLouis]

Tough for me for WSB at night, here 740 Toronto and WJR 760 Detroit and way too strong and squish 750 WSB like a bug.

 

[JoeLouis]

I live near the WSB tower. There are several things working against it. The tower is on the wrong side of the city. The ground conductivity is terrible here anyway (red clay soil), but in that area, there is granite in the ground. If the tower had been put on the other side of Atlanta, it would not have the granite layer in the soil.

Also, 30 years ago they built a shopping center on the tower ground system. Originally, it was state of the art. I am no engineer, but it was explained that all of the building ground systems were tied to the WSB tower ground array. This stopped WSB from coming in on incandescent light bulbs (that really is a thing). Anyway, over the years all of that has aged and not been updated as structures have changed. I am sure the COX side is being kept up to date and in great condition as COX has a long history in Atlanta of having some of the best engineers and are funded..... although, that is probably slowly changing with the new owners.

I found DXing in NYC a challenge, so many 50kw stations nearby, and every Chicago station is exactly just one frequency higher than NY stations 660NY-670Chi - 770NY-780-Chi - 880-NY-890 - Chi-1000 Chi-1010-NY (5 stations?) this had to done on purpose.(1000 Chicago is one frequency lower)

 

[Marcos_C]

I found DXing in NYC a challenge, so many 50kw stations nearby, and every Chicago station is exactly just one frequency higher than NY stations 660NY-670Chi - 770NY-780-Chi - 880-NY-890 - Chi-1000 Chi-1010-NY (5 stations?) this had to done on purpose.(1000 Chicago is one frequency lower)

There's also WGN Chicago (720), which is one frequency higher than WOR New York (710).

 

[JoeLouis]

There's also WGN Chicago (720), which is one frequency higher than WOR New York (710).

Oops I did miss that one, thanks, but is there a reason the FCC did this, it's just too coincidental that '6' Chicago-NY frequencies are 1 frequency apart, kills DXing if you live in those two cities, doesn't affect me though, I'm 75 miles from NYC I get both the NY and Chicago's at night, most of the time the Chicago stations come in better.

 

[Michi]

IIRC, the FCC did change their rules to allow FM analog translators of HD signals, as well as AM signals. It used to be that you could only have a translator for an FM (analog) signal, and it had to be within the contour of the parent FM. This made it impossible for those wanting to get additional FM analog programming on the air.

For HD, the FCC never changed any rules. They only clarified that an HD2 is no different than an analog program output. Thus meaning that the translator can be used to rebroadcast and HD subchannel which is not the main.

The FCC did specifically amend the regulations to allow for AM stations to be rebroadcast.

 

[jabba17]

Oops I did miss that one, thanks, but is there a reason the FCC did this, it's just too coincidental that '6' Chicago-NY frequencies are 1 frequency apart, kills DXing if you live in those two cities, doesn't affect me though, I'm 75 miles from NYC I get both the NY and Chicago's at night, most of the time the Chicago stations come in better.

Were the AM class As allocated like FM and TV were later, or was it merely first-come-first-served?

It has always irked me that Atlanta only has one class A station, although that's rapidly becoming a nonissue.

 

[DavidEduardo]

Were the AM class As allocated like FM and TV were later, or was it merely first-come-first-served?

AMs were never allocated. Everything in the early days when the prime facilities were licensed came from "on demand" requests to build a station.

It has always irked me that Atlanta only has one class A station, although that's rapidly becoming a nonissue.

There are huge cities like Houston and Phoenix and Miami that have no or only one Class A stations.

And many cities have no AM that covers the whole market day and night, like Indianapolis and DC as examples.

 

[RoddyFreeman]

AMs were never allocated. Everything in the early days when the prime facilities were licensed came from "on demand" requests to build a station.

There are huge cities like Houston and Phoenix and Miami that have no or only one Class A stations.

And many cities have no AM that covers the whole market day and night, like Indianapolis and DC as examples.

I'm guessing the reason Atlanta has only one non-directional 50KW AM station is that it was a relatively small market when those licenses were applied for.

When I moved to Atlanta in 1994, it was famously "under radioed" on FM for a market its size. Atlanta was allocated FM frequencies based on its population back when. That certainly has changed over the years with the move-ins. While many of the move-ins initially had signal issues, transmitting and receiving technology have pretty much solved that.

 

[RoddyFreeman]

Also, 30 years ago they built a shopping center on the tower ground system. Originally, it was state of the art. I am no engineer, but it was explained that all of the building ground systems were tied to the WSB tower ground array. This stopped WSB from coming in on incandescent light bulbs (that really is a thing). Anyway, over the years all of that has aged and not been updated as structures have changed. I am sure the COX side is being kept up to date and in great condition as COX has a long history in Atlanta of having some of the best engineers and are funded..... although, that is probably slowly changing with the new owners.

The shopping center parking lot was built over the WSB ground system, but the stores were not. The ground system extends to the curbs and yes, the stores are tied to it. I was told by a WSB engineer that any electrical repair or adjustment in the stores needs to be supervised by a WSB engineer. So I would bet the age of the structures is not an issue.

According to a former WSB engineer, the idea to build the shopping center was based on the success of an industrial park built around the KFI transmitter and tower. The proposal was brought to WSB by Tramell Crow, a real estate developer, which paid for the construction.

 

[DavidEduardo]

I'm guessing the reason Atlanta has only one non-directional 50KW AM station is that it was a relatively small market when those licenses were applied for.

Absolutely. Look at the huge cities, today, in Florida that have vastly inferior AM stations. Miami, Orlando, Jax, Tampa, Ft. Myers, Tallahassee, Pensacola, all of which are large to huge markets today.

Or Houston and Austin, Memphis and Kansas City, Raleigh-Durham, Tidewater VA, Jackson, MS, Little Rock, the large cities in OK and KS

When I moved to Atlanta in 1994, it was famously "under radioed" on FM for a market its size. Atlanta was allocated FM frequencies based on its population back when. That certainly has changed over the years with the move-ins. While many of the move-ins initially had signal issues, transmitting and receiving technology have pretty much solved that.

And look how Docket 80-90 overpopulated markets like San Antonio, Austin, Albuquerque, Phoenix, Las Vegas and others in places where lots of rural assignments could be shuffled and moved in.

 

[BarryATL]

The shopping center parking lot was built over the WSB ground system, but the stores were not. The ground system extends to the curbs and yes, the stores are tied to it. I was told by a WSB engineer that any electrical repair or adjustment in the stores needs to be supervised by a WSB engineer. So I would bet the age of the structures is not an issue.

According to a former WSB engineer, the idea to build the shopping center was based on the success of an industrial park built around the KFI transmitter and tower. The proposal was brought to WSB by Tramell Crow, a real estate developer, which paid for the construction.

Hmmm... maybe my memory is fuzzy. If the ground system does not go under the buildings, then when the shopping center was built, they must have cut a big chunk of the ground system.

I was friends with Dick Bird when I was in high school when he was chief engineer and on air personality at AM 1600 WACX Austell. This is before the shopping center was built. He said WSB had a text book design on their tower and ground system. He said the radials were wide copper straps every 2 degrees and the length of each radial was equal to the height of the tower. If that was true, then they cut some of the ground system if it ends at the curbs.

@RoddyFreeman your memory may be better than mine, so I classify all I just said as fuzzy memory.

None of that matters anymore, but I am always fascinated by the trivia.

 

[RoddyFreeman]

In my hometown of Baltimore, WWIN built its site, and then a shopping center was built over it (the Waverly Tower Shopping Center). In that case, the stores were built over the ground system. The site was built in the 50’s and by the ‘80’s, the station’s ground system had deteriorated to the point where it had to be replaced. Because the stores were over the ground system, the station had to move to a different site and decrease power from 1,000 to 500 watts.

 

[Battenkill50]

Many of the night frequencies audible in this region (East Central Florida) are also used by Cuban transmitters
especially 530-900 KHz....

kw - Melbourne FL

 

[DavidEduardo]

Many of the night frequencies audible in this region (East Central Florida) are also used by Cuban transmitters especially 530-900 KHz....

Cuba dropped out of the NARBA treaty zone that included Mexico, Bahamas, Canada, USA, DR right after the "revolution". They proceeded to put higher power Russian transmitters on all the lower frequencies all the way up to 1200 to block US signals and to create a group of state-owned national and regional networks.

Quite a large handful of FL stations have higher power "temporary" authorizations going back decades to allow them to overcome that interference.

 

[Battenkill50]

Many Caribbean outlets are not heard here lately - except for PJB of course . (The Bahamas are in the Atlantic….)

Formerly several stations from Puerto Rico (WAPA), Santo Domingo (650 & 830) and Venezuela (YVKS 750 & YVMN 780) were audible in the evenings.

Hammered by hurricanes and/or closed by dictators?

kw - Melbourne FL (180 miles north of Miami)