Triv vs. Rizzo

[OhioMediaWatch]

It's been knocking around as a rumor for a while, but is it about to become a reality?

We've had about a half-dozen people E-mail us asking if ESPN 850 WKNR's "Tony Rizzo" was moving his "Really Big Show" from 9-noon to afternoon drive. We hadn't heard any confirmation of the rumor, which is everywhere. (Apparently, Rizz has been hinting about it, and his recent departure from "Fox 8 News" would make it possible.)

Well, rumor or not, it's been blown into public by this tweet/Facebook message from...WTAM/1100 afternoon driver Mike Trivisonno:

TONY THE HAIR PIECE RIZZO WILL TELL EVERYONE HE IS MOVING TO AFTERNOON DRIVE. GOOD LUCK TONY.

(Note that we presume "TheTrivShow" tweets are generally written by his producers, but we also generally presume that the all upper case tweets are his own.)

This could be a big battle, if 'KNR does it right (and frankly, tightens up the show a little).

Triv and 'TAM have advantages that WKNR does not have. They have the service elements as part of 1100's format, and Triv has a huge head start. They also have the muscle of Clear Channel and all the other advantages that come with "being the king".

But Rizzo is a name in the market, and even the mess that is "The Really Big Show" will be a larger audience getter than "Afternoon R&R with Reghi and Roda", or either man separately.

It'll certainly be fun to watch.

After the tweet, I joined up with the RBS...and so far, haven't heard any announcement yet.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

Er...I know Tony uses his real name. Not sure why I put quotes around it, but I can't edit it now.

 

[former interm]

He won't harm Triv too much. Triv is a the killer in Cleveland radio.

What hurts Rizzo is the two boys he has working with him. Sound like high school kids trying to talk sports with the big boys.

 

[vjm]

Don't jump the gun quite yet.

Reghi and Roda just moved to afternoon drive 6 months ago, and Roda also does another hour with former Buckeye and Brown LeCharles Bentley at 6 p.m.

Also, KNR loses power in the afternoons during the winter, which would hurt Rizzo tremedously.

R & R is straight sports compared to Rizzo's all over the board show, and I don't know if they think they can out-Triv Triv.

These major announcements don't necessarily mean programming changes.

They've done these to announce major promotions, contests (like this rediculous contest involving winning a date with "Really Big Show" resident jock chaser/gossip queen Sabrina Parr) or they could be going public with the fact Rizzo is now a "top man" (to use a RBS phrase).

I'm just giving y'all fair warning, so if it's not Rizz to afternoons, you'll be ready.

Besides, Rizz had publically said he left the Fox 8 job to get his life back, as the hours were killing him and wreaking havoc on his marriage.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

I am rather skeptical about it.

The only reason I posted it here, and on the blog, is because of Triv's tweet. As I said, HE apparently believes Rizzo is making the jump, and that alone makes it something to talk about.

It's been rumored around the market for a week or two, and I've been asked about it. But one reason I didn't run with it until now is because I haven't heard it even as a rumor from inside the Galleria.

Triv tweeting about it? Well, I have no choice but to talk about it, now.

I also wouldn't be surprised if this doesn't happen.

As for the hours, Rizz could still do 3-6 and "have a life" (and whatever he does before for 'KNR, even as a part-owner). Getting off TV means he's not coming home at 11, and he could even sleep in more than he does now with a 9 AM start.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

And Rizz basically confirmed his "Top Man" status (our earlier report that he is taking an ownership stake in Good Karma) today.

He said he'd be touring "all 11" Good Karma stations. If you're just a talk show host, you have no reason to tour the company's stations in Beaver Dam WI (other than to visit HQ).

And he (humorously) ripped general manager Keith Williams - who would be his boss if he were not part-owner, no? - for nominating himself for various company awards, because "he fired 17 people" (whatever that means).

 

[former interm]

Does anyone have the ratings #s as they stand right now. Triv probably has 5 to 6 times as many listeners as R&R does right now. I doubt Rizzo can make that big of dent.

KNr has made some good moves in the last few years. Bringing in Reghi was a good move and adding more local content at night was a good move.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

I don't have the numbers in front of me - I can probably get 'em, but OMW doesn't generally do ratings analysis for any number of reasons. But that is probably not that far off re: Triv vs. R&R.

Rizzo would do better. He's a higher profile name and would draw new attention to 'KNR's afternoon drive slot.

But do not at all underestimate the massive advantage Triv and WTAM have right now.

Triv has been #1 or close nearly the entire time he's been in PM drive. The station's service elements (news/traffic/weather/etc.) won't be matched by WKNR, especially the news part.

And Rizzo would have to tangle, on the lower end of his demos, with Alan Cox over on WMMS. As I've said on Twitter, it'd mostly be a demo battle between Triv and Rizzo, with Alan Cox taking the younger end, but there's still some overlap to concern any possible new spoken word show in PM drive.

 

[Nathan Obral]

If this is indeed the case (swapping Rizzo for Reghi/Roda) let me just say that I nailed it back on December 30 on the "106.5 Stunting" thread:

And WKNR isn't gonna put Rizzo up against Trivisonno, Rizz is doing fine where he is, and I'll stick to my guns and say that expansion = going 8 a.m. - noon with Mike and Mike going 6-8 on 850 and 8-10 on 1540 (with an M&M simulcast until 8 when KNR2's daytime sign on schedule cooperates).

I don't see a 8a-12p time slot at all. Why would ESPN Radio permit half of their flagship program to be thrown onto KNR2, given that half of the lead-in to M&M is preempted for Munch's hour-long show? Unless an agreement is made to excise the ESPN name from WKNR's branding, and WWGK finally goes through on that upgrade to 3,500 watts, that ain't happening.

There's also a 10a-2p slot possibility, also resulting in Reghi/Roda getting an additional hour. Hey, good luck selling that to Rome fans.

3p-7p is the only possibility (in tandem with scooting Reghi/Roda to 9a-12p) that wouldn't attract the ire of the Bristol folk.

Again, that still holds true.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

At least some at Oak Tree don't think Rizzo is moving to PMD. Or so Chad Zumock (Alan Cox Show) told me in a long Twitter conversation earlier today...

 

[former interm]

Is there any chance KNR will add more to their website. Such as having web camera in studio to view the show (maybe they already do and I missed it). And how about adding more content to the website and having some good writers to report on the Cleveland sports scene. I am looking at the investment ESPN has made in local markets (Chicago, Dallas, LA, Boston) and hiring known print reporters for their websites. Look at the page views for Yahoo, Fox Sports, ESPN.com, Fanhouse.etc...for all the content they have.

I know Bristol has no interest in it, but I would love for Good Karma to invest more on content for their website. Then again, it takes $$$ to get someone from the Plain Dealer and I am not sure how much money Good Karma has to spend. Landing someone like Tony Grossi (example) would require six figures minimum.

 

[Nathan Obral]

Don't jump the gun quite yet.

Reghi and Roda just moved to afternoon drive 6 months ago, and Roda also does another hour with former Buckeye and Brown LeCharles Bentley at 6 p.m.

Just because the "Power Hour" at 6p is hosted by Roda and LeCharles Bentley doesn't mean that the show still exists in that configuration. For all we know, Bentley could become a part of the fourth hour of tRBS, or "Xs and Os" with Bentley and J'Rod Cherry gets expanded to a 6p-8p slot. Either one is a logical possibility.

Also, KNR loses power in the afternoons during the winter, which would hurt Rizzo tremedously.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again... WKNR NEEDS TO BE ON FM. PERIOD. Their night signal is imperceptible west of Crocker Road in Westlake, let alone ANY part of Lorain County. The 850 night signal is utterly worthless.

In a few years, the signal will basically be rendered as useless as the AM/1300 signal (which does very well in it's current incarnation as gospel-formatted WJMO, but when it still was WERE, they couldn't compete with 3WE/WTAM as a talk station because the signal doesn't reach the western suburbs).

R & R is straight sports compared to Rizzo's all over the board show, and I don't know if they think they can out-Triv Triv.

Fox Sports Radio's flagship show, hosted by Petros Papadakis and Matt Smith, is an all-over the board show (in afternoon drive on the West Coast, ergo the network's other name, "SuperStation KLAC"). They take pride in NOT being straight sports whatsoever, heck, they often REFUSE to talk sports for long periods of time (and whenever it is about sports, it's sucking up to either the Lakers, the Dodgers or USC - Petros' alum).

It's an dreadful show, heck, it's one of the worst nationally-syndicated sports shows in the entire country (I would argue it's as bad - if not worse - as tRBS but that would launch a massive argument). But it set a template for a sports station being able to have an all over the board show in afternoon drive. And quite honestly, Rizz's probably plays out better in the slot than late morning.

These major announcements don't necessarily mean programming changes.

They've done these to announce major promotions, contests (like this rediculous contest involving winning a date with "Really Big Show" resident jock chaser/gossip queen Sabrina Parr) or they could be going public with the fact Rizzo is now a "top man" (to use a RBS phrase).

They made the announcement of Rizzo taking an ownership stake in Good Karma today (Monday).

Heck, perhaps the announcement on Friday is that tRBS gets simulcast on some of the other Good Karma stations (most of which ARE ESPN affiliates).

 

[SonoSational18]

Let's see who's taken a run at Trivisonno so far.... The Sports Babe, Geoff Sindelar, Kenny Roda, Greg Brinda, Alan Cox, Maxwell, Les Levine, Opie & Anthony... to name a few. None have unseated Trivisonno. The reason Triv's show works is because it isn't all X's and O's sports..... plus the service elements (as mentioned previously).... and the best signal in the market.

 

[Nathan Obral]

Let's see who's taken a run at Trivisonno so far.... The Sports Babe, Geoff Sindelar, Kenny Roda, Greg Brinda, Alan Cox, Maxwell, Les Levine, Opie & Anthony... to name a few. None have unseated Trivisonno. The reason Triv's show works is because it isn't all X's and O's sports..... plus the service elements (as mentioned previously).... and the best signal in the market.

As OMW has mentioned before, Maxwell or Cox really can't be called competitors against Triv in the sense that anyone else on the list has. Both were/are employed by the same company and were/are targeting different demos than Triv would.

Everyone else is fair game. And The Fabulous Sports Babe was an abomination that Jacor set up only to benefit Triv and WTAM when that practical joke was unleashed in 1998.

 

[vjm]

Nate-

I don't really see Rizz as a multi-market guy (subbing for Rome not withstanding).

Rizzo's whole shtick is he's a Cleveland guy talking Cleveland sports (and whatever else pops in his newly shaven head...check put the video of him getting his dome shaved on You Tube...yes, it WAS a rug all these years).

Now Hammer and Ned talk about "Dancing with the Stars" and other silly stuff, but Rizzo's whole popularity comes from the fact that he wears his Cleveland fandom on his sleeve and "feels our pain" more than anyone.

Hell, even Hammer and Ned's whole gimmick is about being anti-Cleveland/Buckeyes. That stuff plays in Cleveland as "guys you love to hate", but elesewhere, who cares?

I don't see a show talking primarily Cleveland/OSU playing well in Milwaukee or West Palm Beach.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

O&A actually unseated Triv 12-plus, I think, for I believe a book or two, at the height of their popularity, pre-Sex-in-a-Church, first run.

I'd like to see the demo numbers, though, as presumably O&A would appeal to similar younger demos that Alan Cox does now, and Maxwell did previously.

I think Rizzo has "a shot", but I don't think he has a shot of overturning Triv and WTAM, for all the advantages I posted previously. And as noted here, 'KNR has signal problems after dark that full-time 50 kW flamethrower WTAM does not have.

I agree that 'KNR needs an FM stick if it's going to compete head-to-head with WTAM, but that's not happening. There's no indication ELB will sell 107.3, and CBS won't split off their FMs piecemeal.

'KNR needs a beachfront (lakefront?) PBP contract, just one - like it had with the Indians in the team's last glory years of the 1990s, well before Craig bought it. But the three major teams seem locked up at Oak Tree in perpetuity.

 

[Capulet]

1) RBS on afternoon drive on 850 will get no more listeners than Regi, Munch, Roda, Brinda, Karlovick, Drennon, whoever talks only sports.
2) RBS on afternoon drive will not impact WTAM at all.

Why?

1) Sports is a niche format.
Mass appeal talk is, mass appeal. Sure, most of the Cleveland audience wants to hear who the new coach is. They don't want to hear talk about if he is a good choice for 3 weeks, or if a basketball player sent a tweet.

2) News, Traffic, Weather. WKNR does this not. Inexperienced interns assembling the content for on air beginners is what they do have.

What might work is to put the RBS on AM drive. Add some rip and read headlines and traffic. You might have a mrning show there. But given the fact that WKNR cannot power up until sunrise makes that scenario a moot point. 850 signal is hideously hampered sunset to sunrise.

Keep RBS 9-noon. Get a director who has some expereince managing morning show. Pay a pro to direct the show. ( Where do you find that skill set in this day and age? )The horribly inexperienced kid from Denver being an on air PD is what is killing them. Ask Rizzo. He'll tell you.

 

[Capulet]

Let's see who's taken a run at Trivisonno so far.... The Sports Babe, Geoff Sindelar, Kenny Roda, Greg Brinda, Alan Cox, Maxwell, Les Levine, Opie & Anthony... to name a few. None have unseated Trivisonno. The reason Triv's show works is because it isn't all X's and O's sports..... plus the service elements (as mentioned previously).... and the best signal in the market.

All true. Add the value of cume building from baseball,football, and basketball broadcasts. Not hard to quantify.

Add the current weak competition. The level of afternon drive radio performance in this market graded on interest/content/entertainment value is low. Much of WTAM's top rated position in afternoon drive is the result of little or no quality on air in the traditional Arbitron time slot 3-7pm. Borrowing the football analogy: Easy to win when you play the little sisters of the poor.

 

[Nathan Obral]

1) RBS on afternoon drive on 850 will get no more listeners than Regi, Munch, Roda, Brinda, Karlovick, Drennon, whoever talks only sports.

I actually won't disagree with that. However, I have a feeling that the move may still be considered, and it may come to pass... but it could be a colossal mistake.

2) RBS on afternoon drive will not impact WTAM at all.

Why?

1) Sports is a niche format.
Mass appeal talk is, mass appeal. Sure, most of the Cleveland audience wants to hear who the new coach is. They don't want to hear talk about if he is a good choice for 3 weeks, or if a basketball player sent a tweet.

2) News, Traffic, Weather. WKNR does this not. Inexperienced interns assembling the content for on air beginners is what they do have.

What might work is to put the RBS on AM drive. Add some rip and read headlines and traffic. You might have a mrning show there. But given the fact that WKNR cannot power up until sunrise makes that scenario a moot point. 850 signal is hideously hampered sunset to sunrise.

There's also that little bugaboo about the Mike and Mike clearance. Primarily because WWGK/1540 is a non-starter with their 18 watt pre-sunrise/post-sunset authority signal (barely receivable beyond West 9th - I actually tested it once while driving) there's no way ESPN's flagship show lands on there. And it won't be paired back any further to an 8am start time.

Ceteris paribus, however, Rizzo's show would be perfect for a 6a-10a slot, followed by Cowherd - or heck, even Munch! - from 10a-12p... followed by Rome, Reghi/Roda, etc. The style of the show is more suited for a morning zoo.

And of course for news and weather... pipe in Metro in Detroit for an outsourced feed. In fact, WKNR has done that in the past (pre-Drennan, as a matter of fact).

Keep RBS 9-noon. Get a director who has some expereince managing morning show. Pay a pro to direct the show. ( Where do you find that skill set in this day and age? )The horribly inexperienced kid from Denver being an on air PD is what is killing them. Ask Rizzo. He'll tell you.

Individually, Aaron and Ned may be good follies for the "bad cop/good cop" scenario with Rizzo, but NOT together at the same time. And they have shown time and time again that they can't talk sports successfully by themselves.

Until Craig buys the ESPN affiliate in Denver and ships off Aaron Goldhammer as that station's prodigal son, he is assured lifetime employment at WKNR. And Rizzo has had to play the company line and praise both meatheads, Aaron and Ned.

With Tony taking an actual ownership role, who knows? Maybe Aaron gets promoted to PD at the West Palm Beach station, for all we know (reuniting with former on-air partner Jordan Sherwood, for one).

 

[Capulet]

" ownership role " ? what a joke! what does that REALLY mean? Someone explain this to me. Did Bad Karma re-mortgage the properties and put Rizzos name on the notes? He's responsible for the debt? Somehow that ain't working. Not for me. Recently fired TV sports Italian goy-boy who never held a management position suddenly " owns " a " part " of what the NYC media family bought so the old man's kid has a " job" ? And Mel did this ( took on a new ownership partner ) why?