Proactive approaches to new music

[JimmyJames]

Seeking thoughts on:

Is CHR in general moving fast enough on new music and breaking hits?

What CHRs do the best job of finding new pop records, regardless of genre?

 

[kms575]

Z 100 has to be one of the best at this in the USA.

 

[Roger That]

There is no blanket statement that can be applied to the entire format. It should be dealt with by station.

Z100 is excellent at it, because they have the people and resources to take a chance on something they believe in, and then ASK THEIR AUDIENCE their thoughts on it, and in multiple ways (traditional callout, Rate the Music, phones, AMTs, etc). And if they've picked a turd, they get off of it.

The difference between Z100 and all the small market stations (many of whom seem to be on these boards) that preach about how progressive they are and should be, is that these smaller stations try to do the same thing, yet don't have the resources to back any of their decisions up. Or, more importantly, the resources to call their bullsh!t when they make an error by picking a bad record. Also, you see small market radio stations sending any record they add through the entire station life-cycle, meaning if they add it, it will definitely make it to power at some point.

It's not the format, but I used to work in a market that had an Alt station that always cracked me up. They were so "too cool for the room" that they even alienated their own audience. Sure, they had a few loyal followers, but barely cracked a 1-share, and were never a player in the market. Record companies LOVED them, but their potential audience didn't.

There are CHR stations that very much SHOULD be breaking new music. But it's only a select few. CHR stations should be PLAYING the hits...not MAKING them. And by that, I mean if you play 20-23 currents, maybe ONE on your playlist could/should be something completely unproven that you firmly believe in (YOU...not the record company). As I've found in numerous Selector reviews for small market stations, though, as many as 7-10 of those records could be in that realm, and that's not the way to win over an audience.

 

[kms575]

CHR stations should be PLAYING the hits...not MAKING them.

How do you get a hit song without someone at a CHR with the cajones to make a hit by playing something new and diffenent?

 

[Roger That]

How do you get a hit song without someone at a CHR with the cajones to make a hit by playing something new and diffenent?

Re-read what I wrote. You DO need that. Just not from everyone. The problem is, CHR PD's think that because they're in the position, it somehow qualifies them to dictate what's cool. Many are 40+ year old MEN, trying to pick the hits for 18-34 year old WOMEN. If your market has the resources to gauge audience reaction to a record (phones alone do not count, and rarely does Rate The Music by itself), THEN you can take a chance or two and pick what you think are going to be the hits.

For those "live and local" naysayers, there is still room for local flair. It's about gathering the most data you can to make the best educated decision for your market, NOT about just playing what Z100 plays. Let the big boys pick some new stuff, and test it, and see how it goes. If multiple large markets are seeing great potential on a record you want to play, great! Play it. Move forward, and keep watching it. Find radio stations in bigger markets that have the same lean or focus that you do, and follow what their choices are. You may not match up exactly, but if they're successful doing the same thing you're trying to do, why not take that lead?

I've been in markets with virtually no resources, and this approach has WORKED. Those stations sounded uniquely (insert market) because we picked the stuff that made the most sense for what we were doing competitively. The difference between me and most, though, is that I picked from the pool of records that I knew were hits. Funny...my abundant audience didn't seem to mind.

Your listeners do not know or care if you're the first in the country to "break" a record. That's old-school, radio-ego bullsh!t that means nothing to your listeners. It's amazing to me how important it is to the majority of low-self-esteem programmers out there to be recognized in the trades, and among the record community. Your job is to get ratings, and that means playing what the AUDIENCE expects and wants you to play, not the industry.

 

[CHRles]

Alright, so we know that the Youngstown CHRs aren't big on new music, and we know that Z-100 NYC does play its fair share of new music. Playing a good amount of new music may not work everywhere, but being overly conservative or just relying on major market playlists may not be the best course of action either.
I agree with Roger that more new music may not necassarily translate into anything other then an ego stroke. Some stations sound great just by being straight down the middle like Hot 99.5 Washington or 106.1 Kiss FM. They have the personalities to back it up, and the music mix and imaging help give them an identity.

Still, for some stations being new music leaders works, and I think you'll see more of them in 2009. Stations in the Top 300 markets that report to the CHR/Pop panel on Radio & Records and Billboard that I'd bill as Active Hits:

Z-100 New York
Amarillo's 96.9 Kiss FM
98.5 Kiss FM Peoria
101.3 KDWB Minneapolis
Sirius Hits 1
Hot 107.9 Syracuse
KISR 93.7 Ft. Smith
KJ 103 Oklahoma City
96.3 The Rose Cape Cod
104.7 KCLD St. Cloud
Kiss 95.1 Charlotte
Power Hits 97.5 Junction City-Manhattan
Channel 94-1 Omaha
Kiss 95.7 Hartford
K-104.7 Poughkeepsie
Radio Now 100.9 Indianapolis
KZ 103 Tupelo
103.7 Kiss FM Milwaukee
B-93.7 Greenville
93.1 KQID Alexandria
93.7 KRQ Tucson
Hot 93.1 Rapid City
93.3 FLZ Tampa
Channel 96.3 Wichita
Hot 101.9 Billings
94.9 ZHT Salt Lake City
94.5 KSMB Lafayette
Z-102.9 Cedar Rapids
104.7 Kiss FM Phoenix
Wild 102.9 Reno
Q-107.3 Columbus (Ga)
B-97 New Orleans
Q-92 Canton
Radio Now 97.5 Lansing
Channel 94-5 Dayton
95.5 WIFC Wausau
Kiss 98.5 Buffalo
Z-101 Buffalo
101. WIXX Green Bay
103 X Florence, SC
93.7 STW Wilmington
Q-105 New London
Mix 97.7 Myrtle Beach
103.3 The Vibe Daytona Beach
107.1 The Monkey Gulfport-Biloxi

 

[Roger That]

...but being overly conservative or just relying on major market playlists may not be the best course of action either.

Please don't let this turn into the kind of ignorance that floods the format. Look deeper into what I wrote. I'm not suggesting copy what they're playing exclusively. I'm just suggesting that if you don't have the resources to properly (and ACCURATELY) serve your audience musically, let some of the bigger boys do some of the heavy lifting...then, cherry-pick the best of the best. Make great local decisions based on real information, not your gut only.

There's big difference between being conservative, and simply shifting your musical timetable back a couple weeks to let the resource-heavy guys get an early lead. Stop watching and caring about the chart. Put a song into power at the proper number of spins on YOUR station, based on the track record it has at other stations that are ahead of you, regardless of whether or not it's "lost its bullet" on the chart.

 

[franksandhotdogs]

Individual results may vary.  In some places, a more conservative approach works, and a more active approach works in others.  My motto is:  program to your LISTENERS, not the industry.

I'll agree with Roger listeners don't want to hear sets of unfamiliarity and stiffs.  And you can't always determine hits by a chart...some are stiffs in one market and a smash in another.  What's "new" (and what's familiar) at a station depends on when it was added and how many spins its got.  EVERY song you play is going to make people tune out.  There is no song out there that will keep EVERY single listener tuned in.  Supplemental records (B's, new, spikes, gold, recurrents, etc.) help keep TSL going.

We play 35 currents, but we can open up a bit (there's usually about 250 titles in rotation, 300 including X-mas music right now) since don't spin records heavily (the 7 powers usually are spun 60-65 x/wk here), and like most CHRs, slight dayparting.  I don't have research, I don't have a consultant in LA telling me what we should play... I have gut reaction, and listener feedback (I added Secondhand Serenade in April, spun it 500 times before the nearby market Cumulus CHR so-called "competition" touched it).  We rely on requests and person-to-person reactions, and I keep an eye on the nightly countdown. The "Hot or Not" new music feature at 8pm on my station is used to keep potential hits on my radar.  Requests are logged and reports are sent in with with breakouts on perceived demographics and gender so there's a better idea who's requesting what.  Over time, I've managed to learn which artists and/or types of songs work well here.  Charts, big stations, sales figures and nat'l research are taken into account, but not as a life or death guideline.  If you know your P1's well enough, you can have an idea for what they are going to like.

I don't think consultants and research are bad.  If my boss wanted to hire a consultant and spend doe on research, I would gladly work with them and use the research. Respond to this.. tear it down.  I'll be out of town for a few days, so I might not read it right away.

 

[Roger That]

Z-100 New York
Amarillo's 96.9 Kiss FM
98.5 Kiss FM Peoria
101.3 KDWB Minneapolis
Sirius Hits 1
Hot 107.9 Syracuse
KISR 93.7 Ft. Smith
KJ 103 Oklahoma City
96.3 The Rose Cape Cod
104.7 KCLD St. Cloud
Kiss 95.1 Charlotte
Power Hits 97.5 Junction City-Manhattan
Channel 94-1 Omaha
Kiss 95.7 Hartford
K-104.7 Poughkeepsie
Radio Now 100.9 Indianapolis
KZ 103 Tupelo
103.7 Kiss FM Milwaukee
B-93.7 Greenville
93.1 KQID Alexandria
93.7 KRQ Tucson
Hot 93.1 Rapid City
93.3 FLZ Tampa
Channel 96.3 Wichita
Hot 101.9 Billings
94.9 ZHT Salt Lake City
94.5 KSMB Lafayette
Z-102.9 Cedar Rapids
104.7 Kiss FM Phoenix
Wild 102.9 Reno
Q-107.3 Columbus (Ga)
B-97 New Orleans
Q-92 Canton
Radio Now 97.5 Lansing
Channel 94-5 Dayton
95.5 WIFC Wausau
Kiss 98.5 Buffalo
Z-101 Buffalo
101. WIXX Green Bay
103 X Florence, SC
93.7 STW Wilmington
Q-105 New London
Mix 97.7 Myrtle Beach
103.3 The Vibe Daytona Beach
107.1 The Monkey Gulfport-Biloxi

Forgot to ask...how many of those stations are winning? Z100 doesn't count.

 

[andreajesus]

i don't know, Roger - i'll grant you that Z100 in New York is NOT the powerhouse it was 20 years ago, BUT...when it comes to breaking the top hits in ANY genre, Z100 is STILL a heavy hitter in the CHR market (kinda like the MusicRadio 77 of today... )

Andrea in NYC

 

[Roger That]

i don't know, Roger - i'll grant you that Z100 in New York is NOT the powerhouse it was 20 years ago, BUT...when it comes to breaking the top hits in ANY genre, Z100 is STILL a heavy hitter in the CHR market (kinda like the MusicRadio 77 of today... )

Andrea in NYC

Indeed, NO radio station is anything like it was 20 years ago. The landscape, and most importantly, the AUDIENCE has changed. Yet, Z100 is still dominating, particularly in PPM.

But again...they don't really count. With the vast resources at their fingertips, they can afford to take chances on anything they want. They can put something on that they believe in, because when they test it and their audience votes, they have the ability to get rid of it if their listeners don't like it.

Quite frankly, they're the exception that proves the rule. Unless you can boast even some of the resources that Z100 has, you have a better chance of succeeding and being the most mass appeal to your local audience if you spend less time trying to break records.

 

[andreajesus]

i don't know, Roger - i'll grant you that Z100 in New York is NOT the powerhouse it was 20 years ago, BUT...when it comes to breaking the top hits in ANY genre, Z100 is STILL a heavy hitter in the CHR market (kinda like the MusicRadio 77 of today... )

Andrea in NYC

Indeed, NO radio station is anything like it was 20 years ago. The landscape, and most importantly, the AUDIENCE has changed. Yet, Z100 is still dominating, particularly in PPM.

and that's my WHOLE point, Roger - even though Z100 TODAY is NOT Z100 circa 1988, BECAUSE of their domination in CHR, particularly in PPM, they are STILL a force to be reckoned with in terms of breaking records and making an artist - just look at their annual Jingle Ball...

Andrea in NYC

 

[kms575]

Alright, so we know that the Youngstown CHRs aren't big on new music, and we know that Z-100 NYC does play its fair share of new music. Playing a good amount of new music may not work everywhere, but being overly conservative or just relying on major market playlists may not be the best course of action either.
I agree with Roger that more new music may not necassarily translate into anything other then an ego stroke. Some stations sound great just by being straight down the middle like Hot 99.5 Washington or 106.1 Kiss FM. They have the personalities to back it up, and the music mix and imaging help give them an identity.

Still, for some stations being new music leaders works, and I think you'll see more of them in 2009. Stations in the Top 300 markets that report to the CHR/Pop panel on Radio & Records and Billboard that I'd bill as Active Hits:

Z-100 New York
Amarillo's 96.9 Kiss FM
98.5 Kiss FM Peoria
101.3 KDWB Minneapolis
Sirius Hits 1
Hot 107.9 Syracuse
KISR 93.7 Ft. Smith
KJ 103 Oklahoma City
96.3 The Rose Cape Cod
104.7 KCLD St. Cloud
Kiss 95.1 Charlotte
Power Hits 97.5 Junction City-Manhattan
Channel 94-1 Omaha
Kiss 95.7 Hartford
K-104.7 Poughkeepsie
Radio Now 100.9 Indianapolis
KZ 103 Tupelo
103.7 Kiss FM Milwaukee
B-93.7 Greenville
93.1 KQID Alexandria
93.7 KRQ Tucson
Hot 93.1 Rapid City
93.3 FLZ Tampa
Channel 96.3 Wichita
Hot 101.9 Billings
94.9 ZHT Salt Lake City
94.5 KSMB Lafayette
Z-102.9 Cedar Rapids
104.7 Kiss FM Phoenix
Wild 102.9 Reno
Q-107.3 Columbus (Ga)
B-97 New Orleans
Q-92 Canton
Radio Now 97.5 Lansing
Channel 94-5 Dayton
95.5 WIFC Wausau
Kiss 98.5 Buffalo
Z-101 Buffalo
101. WIXX Green Bay
103 X Florence, SC
93.7 STW Wilmington
Q-105 New London
Mix 97.7 Myrtle Beach
103.3 The Vibe Daytona Beach
107.1 The Monkey Gulfport-Biloxi

Strike off Kiss 95.7. It is a total trainwreck now.

 

[Adam Rivers]

It all depends on your situation. Effectively, in Selector, I'm playing 30 records...but the number is a little more because of how heavily dayparted my station is durng the day. We are aggressive on new music. However, I can give you a reason or multiple reasons on why we play every song we play, as much or as little as we do. I'm sure there will be many people on this board that will slam me for playing x record or y record, but there's a reason for it. And maybe I'm wrong, but the approach has worked well from a sales standpoint in my situation.

If I am ever fortunate enough to program in a larger market, I will take the aggressive, custom for my situation, Z100 approach. It's effective and proven to work extremely successfully. CHR is supposed to be the in touch with what's cool and what's hip format... and that's what Z100 is, and why I think it's so successful. There are many CHRs that I fall asleep to because they're so behind on the game, and it reflects in their ratings.

Listeners are a lot more in tune with things and new music then people think they are - and unfortunately most of radio management has forgotten about the listener, the only reason they get a paycheck in the first place. That being said, I base very little if anything on phone calls, because only a small portion of your audience calls the radio station. If there's a pattern noticed, though, it is noted when making category changes and decisions.

 

[Adam Rivers]

I agree with Roger that more new music may not necassarily translate into anything other then an ego stroke. Some stations sound great just by being straight down the middle like Hot 99.5 Washington or 106.1 Kiss FM. They have the personalities to back it up, and the music mix and imaging help give them an identity.

Kiss Dallas breaks a lot of songs and a lot of hits. They aren't as aggressive as Z100 but are extremely balanced, pretty aggressive and excellently dayparted.

 

[franksandhotdogs]

I agree with Roger that more new music may not necassarily translate into anything other then an ego stroke. Some stations sound great just by being straight down the middle like Hot 99.5 Washington or 106.1 Kiss FM. They have the personalities to back it up, and the music mix and imaging help give them an identity.

Kiss Dallas breaks a lot of songs and a lot of hits. They aren't as aggressive as Z100 but are extremely balanced, pretty aggressive and excellently dayparted.

I think he was talking about Kiss Seattle (KBKS), which is also an excellent station.

 

[Roger That]

and that's my WHOLE point, Roger - even though Z100 TODAY is NOT Z100 circa 1988, BECAUSE of their domination in CHR, particularly in PPM, they are STILL a force to be reckoned with in terms of breaking records and making an artist - just look at their annual Jingle Ball...

Andrea in NYC

Then I guess I'm not sure what we're talking about. We both agree that Z100 dominates, and breaks new artists/records while doing it. I think we can put that to rest. I'm trying to make the point that they can do so because they have the resources to test their instincts. Not everyone does. Are you disputing that? :-\

 

[andreajesus]

now that you put it that way, Roger - how can i dispute that?? not everyone is Z100...

Andrea

 

[CHRles]

Performance of the Active Hits stations:

Amarillo's 96.9 Kiss FM - still a fairly new station, but already has nearly a 5 share in the market
98.5 Kiss FM Peoria - made it into the market's Top 10 with a 3.3
101.3 KDWB Minneapolis - 4th in the market overall
Sirius Hits 1 - one of the most listened to stations on satellite radio (as is 20 On 20)
Hot 107.9 Syracuse - third overall, just behind 93 Q. Oftentimes beats the Q.
KISR 93.7 Ft. Smith - third overall
KJ 103 Oklahoma City - tied for third with nearly a 6 share
96.3 The Rose Cape Cod - down in the ratings for a change but still Top 10
104.7 KCLD St. Cloud - 8th overall
Kiss 95.1 Charlotte - back in the 5 shares with a 5.3, good for 6th overall
Power Hits 97.5 Salina-Junction City-Manhattan - ranks first place
Channel 94-1 Omaha - 8th overall
Kiss 95.7 Hartford - 6th overall
K-104.7 Poughkeepsie - 1st place in Newburgh, 2nd in Poughkeepsie
Radio Now 100.9 Indianapolis - 8th overall
KZ 103 Tupelo - third overall
103.7 Kiss FM Milwaukee - third overall
B-93.7 Greenville - 8th overall
93.1 KQID Alexandria - embargoed market
93.7 KRQ Tucson - third overall
Hot 93.1 Rapid City - embargoed market
93.3 FLZ Tampa - 4th overall
Channel 96.3 Wichita - second overall. Been on a real kick in the ratings since summertime
Hot 101.9 Billings - third overall
94.9 ZHT Salt Lake City - 6th overall. Very consisten ratings in one of the most competitive markets
94.5 KSMB Lafayette - 7th overall, bouncing back in the ratings
Z-102.9 Cedar Rapids - embargoed market
104.7 Kiss FM Phoenix - 12th overall, but still ahead of the 2 Rhythmics
Wild 102.9 Reno - second overall
Q-107.3 Columbus (Ga) - 6th overall
B-97 New Orleans - 6th overall
Q-92 Canton - 4th overall with their highest ratings yet
Radio Now 97.5 Lansing - second place
Channel 94-5 Dayton - 11th place, this station is usually an underperformer sadly
95.5 WIFC Wausau - second place
Kiss 98.5 Buffalo - 5th overall
Z-101 Buffalo - only 12th overall, mainly due to its signal coming from Niagra Falls, Ontario
101. WIXX Green Bay - second place
103 X Florence, SC - 8th overall
93.7 STW Wilmington - first place, normally is. Very unique sounding CHR.
Mix 97.7 Myrtle Beach - 5th overall
103.3 The Vibe Daytona Beach - Top 10 despite their tiny signal that doesnt even cover all of Volusia County
107.1 The Monkey Gulfport-Biloxi - 6th overall

 

[Roger That]

If I am ever fortunate enough to program in a larger market, I will take the aggressive, custom for my situation, Z100 approach. It's effective and proven to work extremely successfully. CHR is supposed to be the in touch with what's cool and what's hip format... and that's what Z100 is, and why I think it's so successful. There are many CHRs that I fall asleep to because they're so behind on the game, and it reflects in their ratings.

Listeners are a lot more in tune with things and new music then people think they are - and unfortunately most of radio management has forgotten about the listener, the only reason they get a paycheck in the first place. That being said, I base very little if anything on phone calls, because only a small portion of your audience calls the radio station. If there's a pattern noticed, though, it is noted when making category changes and decisions.

And again...I ask the question...what is being used to suggest that taking a chance on brand new, unproven music in mass quantities is helping? If you don't have research, and don't use phones...what are you using? Honest question. What are you doing other than simply guessing? What if you're wrong...and how do you know when you are?

It's like throwing spaghetti at the wall to see if it sticks, only you have no wall. Or, worse yet, your wall is your ratings, which are 3 months behind. So, you're basing whether something was a hit for you 3 months ago, now that it's already too late, and amongst what could be a lot of other factors (bad in-tab, diary placement, marketing, promotions, etc).

Not picking on you, Adam...just seen this argument a lot of times, and have yet to see a response that offers any answers. The argument states that CHR should be hip and cool, yet you base it on nothing other than one or two programmers (who are 90% likely to NOT even be in the demo) guessing at what they believe will be hits, while hiding behind "well...I know my market." If we can agree on that, then how is that the "cutting edge?" Two non-demo dudes telling their audience what they should like? Sure sounds worse to me than my suggestions.

now that you put it that way, Roger - how can i dispute that?? not everyone is Z100...

Andrea

That's why I said they didn't count. I think that, if every CHR had the same (or even similar) options like they do, they could be as idealistically "cutting edge" as everyone wants the format to be. But realistically, we know that's not happening anytime soon.