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KBME 790AM Sports/Talk changes starting July 9th

The Rimshot said:
How much time to do you spend in the shower? Wait...don't answer that.

It was my understanding that you have to listen on a terrestrial basis to register in the PPM. Did Nielsen change this to accomodate internet-based listeners?
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The radio ratings include streaming of terrestrial stations. If the stream is a 100% simulcast of the over-the-air broadcast, streaming and OTA numbers can be combined in a single figure at the election of the station.

Streaming is always registered in the diary method... it just depends on the listener remembering to write it down. The diary also picks up satellite listening and even pirate stations... whatever the listeners thinks is "radio" (and most listeners think Pandora is "radio", too).

The PPM picks up encoded signals from terrestrial stations including streams and HD signals. Each audio "source" is separately encoded, but simulcasts are usually combined.
 
Wow, a mere AM 790 sports radio staff update has engendered a cascade of blistering responses on everything but ... AM 790 sports radio. That's OK, it's been a healthy interchange that has lit up the recently sleepy RD board. Back to AM 790, why has iHeart failed to land a decent FM translator, I thought they were the Big Dogs on the block.
 
Let's see if I have this straight: Nielsen's mode of operation is to produce lies as the way to operate their business. And the advertisers that buy based on the research somehow gets the results from the listeners that are not hearing those ads and are convinced to buy again and again because they're buffoons. Have I got this right? Is that what you truly expect me to believe? I read people do not listen to radio and that advertisers buy untrue information. Funny thing I have asked for evidence to support this but nobody has given a link to these studies that support that claim. Nielsen has been quoted as support for the side that people do listen. In fact it has been explained how Nielsen's data is checked for accuracy by an independent group.

Funny thing, advertisers buy for results. If they don't get results, they don't advertise again. So, if nobody listened to radio, nobody would advertise and every radio station would be off the air. That is plain fact. That is real world folks.

Obviously if Nielsen is as bogus as claimed by some here and all the ad agencies are convincing clients to buy what does not work, then gentlemen, we have the biggest con that has taken place on this planet. We're not talking some little pyramid scheme but literally billions of dollars controlled by some of the best business minds on earth.

Yes, there is more and more online listening but all the data I see indicates the leaders in online listening are over the air radio stations that stream. Radio listening includes listening to over the air radio on any platform be it a radio or a connected device. I'm not saying over the air radio will stay at it's current level and in fact I think more will move to other devices other than the device we call radio.
 
b-turner said:
Funny thing, advertisers buy for results. If they don't get results, they don't advertise again. So, if nobody listened to radio, nobody would advertise and every radio station would be off the air. That is plain fact. That is real world folks.
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That's a great point. While in the top 10 markets, major stations have to get their share of agency business, in most of the rest of the country, most billing is local direct.

Now those advertisers don't look at Nielsen. They look at the cash register. If they advertise on the radio, and they sell whatever it is they offer, they keep buying radio ads.

If nobody listens, then why do those local direct accounts keep renewing?
 
TheBigA said:
I have a shower radio. It's in my ensuite. Would you have seen that if you came to my house?

BTW you don't have to own a radio to listen to the radio.
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Can it stream music from Pandora or Spotify? If not, maybe you should sue it’s manufacturer for ‘monopolistic practices’.
 
stan said:
Can it stream music from Pandora or Spotify? If not, maybe you should sue it’s manufacturer for ‘monopolistic practices’.
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FM radio isn't a single company. FM radio is like a camera or any other non-specific function on the iPhone.

There's a difference. Having a USB port is a non-specific function. Putting a brand on a dashboard like Sirius is promoting a company. That's why Sirius pays auto manufacturers for placement. FM radio does not. HD Radio requires an agreement between the manufacturer and the auto company. Understand?
 
TheBigA said:
FM radio isn't a single company. FM radio is like a camera or any other non-specific function on the iPhone.

There's a difference. Having a USB port is a non-specific function. Putting a brand on a dashboard like Sirius is promoting a company. That's why Sirius pays auto manufacturers for placement. FM radio does not. HD Radio requires an agreement between the manufacturer and the auto company. Understand?
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I understand that you still don’t understand the iPhone technology and what it can or can’t do. Have fun showering.
 
TheBigA said:
FYI The NAB is not in the electronics business. And HD radio is a trademarked device that's owned by iBiquity.

So no, the NAB couldn't build a receiver.
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But is it rich enough to hire an electronics company/app developer to work for it? Analog radio technology, as far as I know, is no trademark. LOL just playing devil's advocate here...
 
AnyHuman said:
But is it rich enough to hire an electronics company/app developer to work for it? Analog radio technology, as far as I know, is no trademark. LOL just playing devil's advocate here...
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The NAB is a non-profit membership organization. They don't own any radio stations or assets other than membership dues and their headquarters building.

Regarding HD Radio, go to www.hdradio.com and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_Radio to learn about how HD Radio is a proprietary technology, requiring manufacturers to pay a royalty.

I recall several years ago, the publisher of RadioInk, the owner of this site, contracted with a manufacturer to make an HD receiver it called Big Red. Don't know the status of that. It takes money and permission from iBiquity to make an HD radio. Even though iBiquity was sold to DTS a few years ago, the trademark is still in force.
 
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TheBigA said:
The NAB is a non-profit membership organization. They don't own any radio stations or assets other than membership dues.

Regarding HD Radio, go to www.hdradio.com and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_Radio to learn about how HD Radio is a proprietary technology, requiring manufacturers to pay a royalty.
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Thanks for clearing that up, BigA.
I'm not in the media/radio industry.
That stuff about HD radio owning their tech explains why RadioShack abandoned the iOS receivers. I think it was most likely due to low sales, since most average people who aren't into radio and own iPhones used and continue to use streaming services to listen to music.

To be fair, and as others have said on here, FM is a good backup if cell service goes down. The City of San Marcos owns KZOS-LP, and they just promote KZOS-LP as emergency services and not for music services, even though the station plays music most of the time.
https://www.sanmarcostx.gov/283/Local-Radio-Station---1031-FM-KZOS
 
AnyHuman said:
I think it was most likely due to low sales, since most average people who aren't into radio and own iPhones used and continue to use streaming services to listen to music.
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Keep in mind that "most average people" are the ones who in fact listen to radio.
 
Uknowit said:
Sorry. Wrong link. Here is the correct one. Here's the download link for the report with all the statistical evidence.
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Yep I know. Both links quote a study commissioned by the RIAA and SoundExchange designed to get radio to pay record labels a $2 billion royalty. If you read the conclusions towards the end, you'll see what I'm talking about.

The report came out a year ago, was greatly discussed here and in lots of other places, and the sky still hasn't fallen.

One of the main recommendations is that radio needs to invest in digital, and most of the major radio companies as well as NPR have been doing so for years. The most notable is iHeartRadio, which has over 90 million registered users. Of course, the advantage of digital media to the music business is they get billions in royalties. So obviously that's a good thing for them.

If people are not willing to accept Nielsen data because they feel it's tainted, this is a lot worse.

There are a lot of responses to the report, but here's Nielsen's:

https://radioink.com/2017/08/31/nielsen-takes-issue-miller-report/
 
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I might be missing something but it seemed the study centered on 13 to 17 year olds. I didn't see all demographics represented.
 
Uknowit said:
Sorry. Wrong link. Here is the correct one. Here's the download link for the report with all the statistical evidence. http://bit.ly/mrpswrmattrod
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That evaluation is fraught with errors and false premise based conclusions.

How about "Leading music industry analyst Mark Mulligan of Midia Research said “The power of music discovery used to lie in the hands of the radio DJ, now it lies in the hands of the playlist curator. "

DJs have not determined radio playlists for many decades, save a few very isolated instances. In the 50's and 60's, music sales and even juke-box play, determined the songs to be played in current-hits based radio. Later on, music testing took over. So it was the listener making the choices.

On another point, the author talks about the increasing use of streaming as if radio was dead because of it. Most radio stations and companies also do digital. Radio is not in the transmitter business... that is Nautel and Gates and the like.

The author keeps talking about teens; radio does not particularly care about teens as there is no revenue for a teen station. The author is obsessed with music discovery; most radio listeners, particularly those in 25-54 (and above) listen to stations that predominantly feature proven and past hits, not discovery.

Further, the author can't seem to be able to distinguish between users of on-demand services like Spotify and streams, like radio stations, Pandora, etc. Streams are analogous to radio, on demand is analogous to buying 45's, tapes, 8-Tracks and CDs. They are different in ways that the writer, in his desire to present a case for the record business, does not seem to grasp.

And as to Nielsen, he definitely does not get that the PPM is a panel, and the panel is designed to reflect every part of a market proportionally, by age, gender, ethnicity, income, and more. When panel turnover affects proportionality, the affected cell is weighted up or down to achieve proportionality. While they don't always get it perfect, the imperfections tend to favor or hurt specific stations, not overall music taste in the market.

And finally, the author does not understand that the PPM does not discriminate by format type. Or by tempo. Or race. Some formats dropped harder when the PPM came out because certain kinds of listeners had been putting in blocks of listening that vastly exaggerated listening because they did not discount breaks and interruptions in listening. The system was improved, but it hurt some stations that had low cume and high, exaggerated, TSL. Reality bites sometimes, but the ratings are not wrong... they are just more "right" now than in the diary system (which is still used in about 200 markets).

More than anything, the author does not get that the pureplay streams and on-demand services are, without exceptions, unprofitable. Radio, on the other hand, is. The record industry has a revenue problem, so they want to go after the only player on the field who actually makes money. I call a foul. Yellow card. Get your facts straight.
 
DavidEduardo said:
The record industry has a revenue problem, so they want to go after the only player on the field who actually makes money. I call a foul. Yellow card. Get your facts straight.
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As I said a year ago when the study was released, the main thing I learned is that the CD is dead. I just bought a new car last month, and while it has AM/FM in its dash, there is no CD player. This is becoming more common. No one I know buys CDs or listens to them. That is a problem for the recording business that makes money from the sale of CDs. At the same time, the study shows only a fraction of music users pay for a subscription music service. The majority listen for free. That's not good for the long term health of the music business. This is why the organization that funded this study wants to impose a new royalty on broadcast radio stations.

BTW since this is the Houston board, the recording industry commissioned a similar study about ten years ago from the University of Houston. I'm sure it can be found on line somewhere. The findings are amazingly similar, and reach the same conclusion, that broadcast radio must pay record labels a royalty, or it will fail.
 
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TheBigA said:
The PPM measures the signal regardless of what device you use. If it's encoded, the meter picks it up. The point isn't to measure device usage, but to measure exposure to content, or impressions.

If you look at the Nielsen ratings, they're now listing radio station streams. So you have AM, FM, and Stream.
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I believe when we last touched on this topic in 2016, PPMs were registering streams, so that's why I asked.

Nielsen should account for internet streaming, because that's how, from my experiences, the majority of folks listen to radio stations.
 
The Rimshot said:
Nielsen should account for internet streaming, because that's how, from my experiences, the majority of folks listen to radio stations.
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They account for a percentage of people who don't listen to any form of rated radio. But the majority of folks at one time or another use radio.

As I said, if it's encoded, the meter picks it up. That includes streams.
 
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