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Format hole...

S

swhyde1980

Well, now that 95-7 The Jet here in the Seattle area has eliminated the 70s to the most part and went to the "80s and more", effectively becoming just like the old "96-5 The Point", That leaves a big format hole in the Seattle market. No one is playing mainstream 60s or 70s music anymore here....

Enter: The merger between CBS Radio and Entercom. Means now 94.1 KMPS and 100.7 The Wolf are now competing against each other, even though they are now sister stations. Other than Fitz in the morning on The Wolf, it's trailed behind KMPS, which is a heritage station and has more seniority.

My advice to Entercom: Move Fitz to 94.1 KMPS since Fitz is more popular in the mornings for country listeners and I think he would be great there, and flip 100.7 FM to a 60s-70s-80s-90s variety format, like K-Earth 101 in Los Angeles (Since now it's a sister station because of the merger). Maybe "K-Hits 100.7", or "K-Earth 100.7". ??? We're missing the mainstream 60s & 70s here in the Seattle area! It's probably been about a year and a half or so since you heard "Daydream Believer" by the Monkeys in this radio market. We lost something valuable when 104.5 got assimilated by K-Love.

Unless 96-5 Jack FM can pick up the slack and play more 60s and 70s along with the 80s and 90s like when they first started...
 
swhyde1980 said:
Well, now that 95-7 The Jet here in the Seattle area has eliminated the 70s to the most part and went to the "80s and more", effectively becoming just like the old "96-5 The Point", That leaves a big format hole in the Seattle market. No one is playing mainstream 60s or 70s music anymore here....

Enter: The merger between CBS Radio and Entercom. Means now 94.1 KMPS and 100.7 The Wolf are now competing against each other, even though they are now sister stations. Other than Fitz in the morning on The Wolf, it's trailed behind KMPS, which is a heritage station and has more seniority.

My advice to Entercom: Move Fitz to 94.1 KMPS since Fitz is more popular in the mornings for country listeners and I think he would be great there, and flip 100.7 FM to a 60s-70s-80s-90s variety format, like K-Earth 101 in Los Angeles (Since now it's a sister station because of the merger). Maybe "K-Hits 100.7", or "K-Earth 100.7". ??? We're missing the mainstream 60s & 70s here in the Seattle area! It's probably been about a year and a half or so since you heard "Daydream Believer" by the Monkeys in this radio market. We lost something valuable when 104.5 got assimilated by K-Love.

Unless 96-5 Jack FM can pick up the slack and play more 60s and 70s along with the 80s and 90s like when they first started...
Click to expand...

It really isn't a big hole anymore. 60's and 70's formatted stations may be popular for those in their late 50's and 60's, but this without a doubt is NOT a coveted demo. I had a different belief 15 years ago, but no longer. Unfortunately, I tend to like 70's music over the 80's and 90's, but then again, I'm no longer in that coveted demo. Probably best to tune in to your cable or dish 70's channel. I do think an 80's format that also includes MTV hits in addition to radio hits would do well. So far, have not really heard this anywhere.
 
swhyde1980 said:
Well, now that 95-7 The Jet here in the Seattle area has eliminated the 70s to the most part and went to the "80s and more", effectively becoming just like the old "96-5 The Point", That leaves a big format hole in the Seattle market. No one is playing mainstream 60s or 70s music anymore here....

Enter: The merger between CBS Radio and Entercom. Means now 94.1 KMPS and 100.7 The Wolf are now competing against each other, even though they are now sister stations. Other than Fitz in the morning on The Wolf, it's trailed behind KMPS, which is a heritage station and has more seniority.

My advice to Entercom: Move Fitz to 94.1 KMPS since Fitz is more popular in the mornings for country listeners and I think he would be great there, and flip 100.7 FM to a 60s-70s-80s-90s variety format, like K-Earth 101 in Los Angeles (Since now it's a sister station because of the merger). Maybe "K-Hits 100.7", or "K-Earth 100.7". ??? We're missing the mainstream 60s & 70s here in the Seattle area! It's probably been about a year and a half or so since you heard "Daydream Believer" by the Monkeys in this radio market. We lost something valuable when 104.5 got assimilated by K-Love.

Unless 96-5 Jack FM can pick up the slack and play more 60s and 70s along with the 80s and 90s like when they first started...
Click to expand...

I actually think this idea has some really great potential, but perhaps not on any of the frequencies in the CBS/Entercom domain. The experts will strongly voice that it should not be done, but if done right, I don't see a reason why it couldn't pay off. Having said that, I don't think it would be a risk that most of the companies in the market would ever want to attempt. I'm surprised that KJR dropped the 70's from the playlist; it's not like they had any competition. They don't want to be seen as "classic hits", even though that's still what they are in their new incarnation.
 
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swhyde1980 said:
Well, now that 95-7 The Jet here in the Seattle area has eliminated the 70s to the most part and went to the "80s and more", effectively becoming just like the old "96-5 The Point", That leaves a big format hole in the Seattle market. No one is playing mainstream 60s or 70s music anymore here....

Enter: The merger between CBS Radio and Entercom. Means now 94.1 KMPS and 100.7 The Wolf are now competing against each other, even though they are now sister stations. Other than Fitz in the morning on The Wolf, it's trailed behind KMPS, which is a heritage station and has more seniority.

My advice to Entercom: Move Fitz to 94.1 KMPS since Fitz is more popular in the mornings for country listeners and I think he would be great there, and flip 100.7 FM to a 60s-70s-80s-90s variety format, like K-Earth 101 in Los Angeles (Since now it's a sister station because of the merger). Maybe "K-Hits 100.7", or "K-Earth 100.7". ??? We're missing the mainstream 60s & 70s here in the Seattle area! It's probably been about a year and a half or so since you heard "Daydream Believer" by the Monkeys in this radio market. We lost something valuable when 104.5 got assimilated by K-Love.

Unless 96-5 Jack FM can pick up the slack and play more 60s and 70s along with the 80s and 90s like when they first started...
Click to expand...

Hate to break it to you, but K-Earth 101 in LA dropped 60's and 70's last year, plus their great jingles.
 
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seatownmedia said:
Hate to break it to you, but K-Earth 101 in LA dropped 60's and 70's last year, plus their great jingles.
Click to expand...

Yep.

KRTH has been "dropping" the 60's for the better part of a decade, leaving nearly nothing. And they have been peeling off the earlier 70's gradually, leaving only about 19% of the spins over the last 6-week period I checked being from the decade, and 80% of those from '75 to '79. The core years are '82 to '88.

And your point is well taken as 60's and earlier 70's only get you listeners over 55, which is a tough if not impossible sale today.
 
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Bear in mind a decade from now, the '80s will be in the same position as the '70s are now and we'll be having this conversation again.....
 
Bongwater said:
Bear in mind a decade from now, the '80s will be in the same position as the '70s are now and we'll be having this conversation again.....
Click to expand...

Just like a decade ago when Bonneville jettisoned KBSG's oldies format which still had a lot of late '50s and early '60s tunes. Like all things in life - you have to follow the money. There's no money in oldies.
 
DavidEduardo said:


Yep.

KRTH has been "dropping" the 60's for the better part of a decade, leaving nearly nothing. And they have been peeling off the earlier 70's gradually, leaving only about 19% of the spins over the last 6-week period I checked being from the decade, and 80% of those from '75 to '79. The core years are '82 to '88.

And your point is well taken as 60's and earlier 70's only get you listeners over 55, which is a tough if not impossible sale today.
Click to expand...

I get it. But I've also read on RD forums more than once how the Millenials like songs from many different eras and decades, as well as the current stuff. "They don't look at a song as an 80's track, they like a song for what it is -- either they like the song, or they don't. The decade doesn't matter." That's a very rough paraphrase, but it came up in one of the numerous threads on this subject.

So which is it? Why do stations drop older songs if they are good? Perhaps Millenials and Gen Xer's aren't so open to older music as once was thought? Just curious how it fits in to programming stations that play more classic stuff, as opposed to currents.
 
boombox4 said:
So which is it? Why do stations drop older songs if they are good? Perhaps Millenials and Gen Xer's aren't so open to older music as once was thought? Just curious how it fits in to programming stations that play more classic stuff, as opposed to currents.
Click to expand...

While Millennials may latch on to a few older songs, the data does not confirm any significant interest in specific songs. Generally, one person may like this handful of oldies, while another may like that one and there is not that much consensus.

If you take a listener group made up of Millennials... such as listeners to a Hip Hop station... and test some 60's songs you will find horrendously low familiarity and massive dislike. The few songs from way back that even get recognized have no consensus appeal.
 
swhyde1980 said:
Well, now that 95-7 The Jet here in the Seattle area has eliminated the 70s to the most part and went to the "80s and more", effectively becoming just like the old "96-5 The Point", That leaves a big format hole in the Seattle market. No one is playing mainstream 60s or 70s music anymore here....

Enter: The merger between CBS Radio and Entercom. Means now 94.1 KMPS and 100.7 The Wolf are now competing against each other, even though they are now sister stations. Other than Fitz in the morning on The Wolf, it's trailed behind KMPS, which is a heritage station and has more seniority.

My advice to Entercom: Move Fitz to 94.1 KMPS since Fitz is more popular in the mornings for country listeners and I think he would be great there, and flip 100.7 FM to a 60s-70s-80s-90s variety format, like K-Earth 101 in Los Angeles (Since now it's a sister station because of the merger). Maybe "K-Hits 100.7", or "K-Earth 100.7". ??? We're missing the mainstream 60s & 70s here in the Seattle area! It's probably been about a year and a half or so since you heard "Daydream Believer" by the Monkeys in this radio market. We lost something valuable when 104.5 got assimilated by K-Love.

Unless 96-5 Jack FM can pick up the slack and play more 60s and 70s along with the 80s and 90s like when they first started...
Click to expand...

Keep dreamin'.
 
I'm putting my money on Bonneville making trades with Entercom and 100.70 MHz becoming "100.7 ESPN Seattle".
 
I'm not so good at math, but it appears that a song from 1966 is over 50 years old. Tell me your favorite all-time song and movie and I'll tell you approximately how old you are. The point is that the term "oldies" will be different for every demographic group. For a station to stay in a certain demographic group, its music must continually evolve. If it doesn't, the audience will continue to age and die off. To feature hit music from the 60s today would be the same as featuring music from the 40s twenty years ago.
 
This is beyond a doubt the greatest radio argument ever. Twenty years ago, or even 15 years ago, I thought 60's & 70's oldies would survive forever. Wow, I was wrong. And now I understand why. We all identify with music from our teen years, whether it be 12-18, or even early college/young 20's. After this age, we tend to lose interest for obvious reasons.

So let's take a look at the numbers. A 60-year old today will be a fan of the late 60's, and perhaps early 70's. A 50 year old today would likely be a fan of the 70's. A 40 year old today would probably love the 80's, and even creeping into the 90's. A 30-year old today would think anything before about '95 would be considered ancient. A 20-year old today doesn't have any memory of anything before about 2005. These are the facts. Yes, there are rare exceptions where young people have an interest of music before they were of age, but this is rare. So the music rainbow continues to shine, and then go away, then reappear. The circle of life, or the circle of popular music.

All that being said, as a baby boomer, I continually scan the top40 stations today just to see what is going on. And frankly, I like many songs I hear today that are not directed at me. But then again, I spent 40 years in radio so I may be out of the norm. However, I can state that a good song today has the same elements of what my generation liked 35-45 years ago. Some things are universal.
 
Have said it before, but having spent my junior high & high school years in the 70s, I can say that's a decade of pretty wimpy appeal. It didn't take long for oldies/classic hit stations to go from 60s-centric to 80s-centric.

But generally, I'd have to agree that songs much beyond 35 years old are a tough sell to keep in a format appealing to a sub 55 age demo. So long, new wave...sniff.
 
seatownmedia said:
All that being said, as a baby boomer, I continually scan the top40 stations today just to see what is going on. And frankly, I like many songs I hear today that are not directed at me.
Click to expand...

The irony here is that I was born in 1995 and never touch any of the top 40 stations; instead I listen to either 102.5 or 95.7. But it definitely is true, people with an eclectic taste in music are far and from between, and most people are interested in the music in which they are familiar with. It's weird for me to even think that much of this programming is being phased out. Fifteen years ago KBSG was the source for 50's and 60's oldies, and KJR was primarily 70's. Now, it's surprising when you hear any popular 70's song on the radio.


Now, back to the Bonneville speculation. If Entercom DOES sell 100.7 to KIRO, it will be interesting to see what the future has in store for 710. Perhaps they would move KTTH over there for better reception around the region and sell off 770 to the highest bidder.
 
seatownmedia said:
This is beyond a doubt the greatest radio argument ever. Twenty years ago, or even 15 years ago, I thought 60's & 70's oldies would survive forever. Wow, I was wrong. And now I understand why. We all identify with music from our teen years, whether it be 12-18, or even early college/young 20's. After this age, we tend to lose interest for obvious reasons.

So let's take a look at the numbers. A 60-year old today will be a fan of the late 60's, and perhaps early 70's. A 50 year old today would likely be a fan of the 70's. A 40 year old today would probably love the 80's, and even creeping into the 90's. A 30-year old today would think anything before about '95 would be considered ancient. A 20-year old today doesn't have any memory of anything before about 2005. These are the facts. Yes, there are rare exceptions where young people have an interest of music before they were of age, but this is rare. So the music rainbow continues to shine, and then go away, then reappear. The circle of life, or the circle of popular music.

All that being said, as a baby boomer, I continually scan the top40 stations today just to see what is going on. And frankly, I like many songs I hear today that are not directed at me. But then again, I spent 40 years in radio so I may be out of the norm. However, I can state that a good song today has the same elements of what my generation liked 35-45 years ago. Some things are universal.
Click to expand...

I don't spend nearly as much time with the radio as I did 30 and 40 years ago. But I do like to hear the top 40 stations and good current alternative stations to hear what's out there. Top 40 seemed a lot stronger several years ago than it does now. But all formats wane and wax. What makes me sad is how over-processed and over-compressed current music has become. It's destroyed BEFORE radio can get its hands on it and play loudness war games.

Nothing like a good vintage 1985 audio chain with CRLs or Audio Prisms in front of an Optimod. If they were set to provide some compression without being the loudest damn thing in four states, a good engineer who knew his processing could have an FM whose audio simply sparkled. Even though my hearing isn't what it used to be, modern audio processing has gone downhill and it takes the joy out of listening to current music. It could be so much better if it there was even a smattering of dynamic range.
 
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