LA's Oldies/80s 'Consultant' speaks about the new K-SURF

[CTListener]

Clients who don't use ratings are the likely advertisers of this oldies station. They are business that actually want to appeal to seniors and are looking for the few voices in local media who actually deliver seniors efficiently.

The station is probably the only commercial music station attracting a predominantly senior audience. Classical music and jazz might attract seniors, too, but not on AM, and besides, those genres are only played on noncommercial FMs.

Conservative talk and sports also do well on AM. Do any of Saul's clients also advertise on those stations or are the talk/sports outlets all doing agency business exclusively?

 

[34james]

Saul is moving oldies into classic hits a good direction to go in. Now just play 70's and 80's and he will be good.

 

[TheBigA]

Do any of Saul's clients also advertise on those stations or are the talk/sports outlets all doing agency business exclusively?

Saul does some sponsorships for KLON the public radio station in Long Beach. I'd guess they're mostly over 55.

 

[Joey1986]

Saul does some sponsorships for KKJZ the public radio station in Long Beach. I'd guess they're mostly over 55.

Fixed.

 

[TheBigA]

Fixed.

Thanks....I still remember it as KLON

 

[DavidEduardo]

Saul is moving oldies into classic hits a good direction to go in. Now just play 70's and 80's and he will be good.

The problem here is that later 70's music and 80's music was new when FMs were already dominant. 50% of radio listening in 1977 was to FM, and about 60% to 70% of music listening was to FM by then, depending on the market.

So getting a demographic that grew up on FM for the most part to listen to music on AM is pushing the envelope a lot! And doing it on an AM with defective, partial market coverage is pushing it even more.

 

[TheBigA]

So getting a demographic that grew up on FM for the most part to listen to music on AM is pushing the envelope a lot! And doing it on an AM with defective, partial market coverage is pushing it even more.

I wonder what his online stats are. If they exceed on air.

 

[michael hagerty]

Thanks....I still remember it as KLON

Saul actually runs KKJZ under a contract with Cal State Long Beach. He's programming the jazz/standards stuff on KKJZ and running his "Unforgettables" on one of the HDs for that signal.

 

[michael hagerty]

The problem here is that later 70's music and 80's music was new when FMs were already dominant. 50% of radio listening in 1977 was to FM, and about 60% to 70% of music listening was to FM by then, depending on the market.

So getting a demographic that grew up on FM for the most part to listen to music on AM is pushing the envelope a lot! And doing it on an AM with defective, partial market coverage is pushing it even more.

Unless Saul wants to sell or lease the signal out, though, he's running out of AM-friendly formats. For 30 years, he's been keeping, at various times, Classical, Standards and Oldies alive on 1260. And he's done news and talk there, too.

 

[TheBigA]

Saul actually runs KKJZ under a contract with Cal State Long Beach. He's programming the jazz/standards stuff on KKJZ and running his "Unforgettables" on one of the HDs for that signal.

And sells sponsorships and various funding announcements that run on the station.

 

[landtuna]

People 65 and up AREN'T dying off fairly rapidly? Then who are? I thought dying is what older people do a lot sooner than younger people do. Has basic human biology changed recently? Or are you implying that there are huge numbers of younger people who enjoy '50s-style music, despite their characterization as outliers by people whose job it is to monitor that sort of thing?

I take issue with your statement of "fairly rapidly". Of course, as people age their life expectancy at any one time is less than that of a 15 or 30 year old but that doesn't mean it becomes "rapid" unless you quantify that statistic. From the time I was in first grade through my time in the navy I lost about 15 peers. In the past two decades I have lost about the same number. It is worthy to note than not a single one has died from old age.

 

[CTListener]

I take issue with your statement of "fairly rapidly". Of course, as people age their life expectancy at any one time is less than that of a 15 or 30 year old but that doesn't mean it becomes "rapid" unless you quantify that statistic. From the time I was in first grade through my time in the navy I lost about 15 peers. In the past two decades I have lost about the same number. It is worthy to note than not a single one has died from old age.

Where did I say they were dying of old age? They are dying of the sort of things that happen more often to people over 65 -- cancer, heart attacks, strokes, the cumulative effects of diabetes.

I'll match your personal anecdote -- although they never apply to a scientific sampling of people who aren't you and your acquaintances (or me and mine, for that matter) -- and tell you that I've lost three times as many high school classmates -- 12 -- over the past 20 years than in the years from childhood to 44 -- 4. And of the four classmates who died early, one committed suicide in his 30s, one was hit by a car and died in his 30s, the other had cystic fibrosis from birth and died just a few years after graduating. Of those lost in the past 20 years, one was in an accident, while the others died either of cancer, stroke or heart attack.

To me, "dying of old age" is a nebulous term that people use to describe a slow failure of multiple systems in people generally 90 and over. My 64-year-old classmates aren't dying of that, nor are your old chums, unless you are a lot older than I think you are.

 

[landtuna]

Where did I say they were dying of old age? They are dying of the sort of things that happen more often to people over 65 -- cancer, heart attacks, strokes, the cumulative effects of diabetes.

I'll match your personal anecdote -- although they never apply to a scientific sampling of people who aren't you and your acquaintances (or me and mine, for that matter) -- and tell you that I've lost three times as many high school classmates -- 12 -- over the past 20 years than in the years from childhood to 44 -- 4. And of the four classmates who died early, one committed suicide in his 30s, one was hit by a car and died in his 30s, the other had cystic fibrosis from birth and died just a few years after graduating. Of those lost in the past 20 years, one was in an accident, while the others died either of cancer, stroke or heart attack.

To me, "dying of old age" is a nebulous term that people use to describe a slow failure of multiple systems in people generally 90 and over. My 64-year-old classmates aren't dying of that, nor are your old chums, unless you are a lot older than I think you are.

I was quibbling about your use of "rapid" and not the cause of death.

 

[boombox4]

People are living longer than they used to. Statistical fact. Carry on.

 

[DavidEduardo]

People are living longer than they used to. Statistical fact. Carry on.

But advertisers have next to no interest in reaching the geezer demos.

And, actually, life expectancy has plateaued in the US and is declining in some areas.

 

[adradio]

Love the discussion. Reminds me of how important radio was (still is) to those of us in the 55+ demo. I doubt you would get this much passion from the current radio target demo. In our day, with limited entertainment choices, personality driven radio, radio was a pretty big deal. Now it feels like radio is something people have on in the background in the car, without much emotional investment in it.

Question: Is there any passion out there from the younger demo over their favorite radio stations? In 20 years, would any of these people engage in these kind of discussions over radio?

 

[TheBigA]

Question: Is there any passion out there from the younger demo over their favorite radio stations?

Responses will different when choices are limited vs when choices are unlimited. If there's only one pizza place in town, it's the best place in the world. When there's one on every corner, it's not that special.

The passion today seems mainly driven by the music. Which is primarily what drove the passion 50 years ago.

 

[DOB]

With Stranger Things and such the 80s are cool to the younger demos and that is why so many classic hits stations have killer 18-34 numbers. K-earth is very tight, but it is working for them. i just find it funny here with cbs-fm. So many songs I think would be great for them and they never played them at all. Then all of a sudden they are added to the playlist and you hear them frequently. I've heard the...well now alot of the rhythmic 80s stuff is testing. Like it just out of the blue went from a bad play to a good one. No, these songs have always been hits beloved by the audience they serve. There is a nice library of 80s to be played beyond the usual. However, while it probably would do even better than what they do now, these classic hits stations will drop and add songs month by month based on flawed music tests.

 

[DavidEduardo]

With Stranger Things and such the 80s are cool to the younger demos and that is why so many classic hits stations have killer 18-34 numbers. K-earth is very tight, but it is working for them. i just find it funny here with cbs-fm. So many songs I think would be great for them and they never played them at all. Then all of a sudden they are added to the playlist and you hear them frequently. I've heard the...well now alot of the rhythmic 80s stuff is testing. Like it just out of the blue went from a bad play to a good one. No, these songs have always been hits beloved by the audience they serve. There is a nice library of 80s to be played beyond the usual. However, while it probably would do even better than what they do now, these classic hits stations will drop and add songs month by month based on flawed music tests.

KRTH does not have "killer" 18-34 numbers. It has "killer" 35-54 numbers, and the 18-34 is spillage from the older demos. Same with CBS-FM. It's generally in the top 3 in 35-64 but around 10th in 18-34

When you look at rating and not share, you can see where the real listening is coming from. And when you look at where the heavy listeners are, you see it even more in the age of the P1s.

Stations like CBS-FM and KRTH do not test music "month by month". In today's economy, they likely test once or twice a year. Any ongoing changes are due to the programmers cycling in and out the weakest playable songs on the most recent test.

There is no reason to suspect that the music tests done by those stations are flawed in any way. In fact, we can assume they are very well done given the results in the ratings.

 

[oldies76]

Saul is moving oldies into classic hits a good direction to go in. Now just play 70's and 80's and he will be good.

AS LONG as it does not sound like a KRTH from the pre Kaye years (1990-2004), thats fine and dandy. A dream station today in a large market is to play all those great nuggets from the 60s thru the early 80s. Hope they succeed, L.A. needs a much better alternative to K-Earth and if done right, will eat into their base.