You never had to pay for KTLA+. However, when KRON ON originally launched, you did have to pay for that, yes. But they've since dropped it and has been free for a long time now.
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Local Newscasts available over the internet
- Thread starter alg2468
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You never had to pay for KTLA+. However, when KRON ON originally launched, you did have to pay for that, yes. But they've since dropped it and has been free for a long time now.
I had in mind more a regular 30- or 60-minute nightly newscast with coverage of local and regional stories, ENG capabilities to the extent a PBS station's budget allows, the usual format of weather and sports, and so on, IOW, a clone of local commercial newscasts, just on public TV. WOUB and KPBS seem to be two of the only PBS stations in the country to do that, and I can't speak to KPBS, but WOUB's news operation is basically a broadcast journalism practicum for Ohio University. It's not bad for what it is.
WUFT Gainesville came calling with their own 30-minute weekday newscast at 5:00 p.m. (at least during the Winer, Fall, and Spring semesters). Its a broadcast journalism practicum for the University of Florida.
Southeastern Ohio is weird where TV markets are concerned. Much of it (all the way down to Pike County, but curiously, not Vinton County) is the Columbus market, and I have to doubt that Appalachian Ohio is anything more than a peripheral interest of the Columbus stations, it's just too economically and culturally distinct from Columbus, and the population is small. The far southern counties fall into the Charleston-Huntington market, which provides halfway adequate coverage of the Ohio side of the market, but at the end of the day, it's out-of-state news which far more emphasizes West Virginia (WSAZ is the best regional station in that regard). Portsmouth still gets WSYX and WBNS via cable (OTA reception would only be possible in the far northern part of Scioto County), but Ironton, curiously, no longer gets any Ohio stations via cable, you'd think they'd get at least WBNS or WLWT, which they once did. Jackson County is "neither fish nor fowl", cable carries both markets, but falls into C-H kind of by default.
As far as Parkersburg is concerned, that is kind of an "accidental market", it was originally intended to be the western nexus of a "Clarksburg-Parkersburg" market, a smaller and further-north version of the Charleston-Huntington market, but that didn't work due to terrain and, possibly, difficult highway connections up that way. So WTAP was left basically "sucking air" and the area morphed into a tiny, single-station infill market not unlike Zanesville. I'm not sure to what extent they even regard Athens County as part of their coverage area. By all rights, Parkersburg should be an extension of the C-H market (with WTAP possibly being a satellite of WSAZ not unlike the arrangement with fellow Gray stations WKYT and WYMT in Kentucky) and Zanesville should be subsumed into Columbus (which will probably happen if NBC ever pulls the WHIZ affiliation), but for the moment, they are separate markets unto themselves. And a Zanesville-Parkersburg market (with either WHIZ or WTAP dropping NBC and going with ABC, CBS, or even Fox as primary) would be kind of weird as well, a "long" market with, unless I'm missing something, no real connection between Zanesville and Parkersburg aside from fairly close proximity to one another.
Here's my "fantasy map" of what separate Charleston-Beckley-Bluefield, Huntington, and Zanesville-Parkersburg markets might look like, and I threw in a Hazard market in Kentucky just for fun:
I gave Pike and Adams counties in Ohio to the Huntington market --- they are, as things exist now, peripheral afterthoughts to the Cincinnati (Adams) and Columbus (Pike) markets --- and stopped the CBB market at the WV state line "just because".
KAWE/KAWB Bemidji/Brainerd, MN has a weeknight 10pm news under the name ‘Lakeland News’. It has news articles from Northern/Central MN because Minneapolis stations don't care about Northern MN unless its something huge (the Minneapolis DMA is huge and Bemidji is over 200 miles away from Minneapolis but still in the market). Since its on satellite in the Minneapolis DMA it is nice to see the weather for the lake house (which is a half hour from Brainerd) so we can plan better.
It would qualify as "small market" news (like what I see on KEYC Mankato....mainly articles on local area)
That reminds me of the situation with Adams and Pike counties in Ohio. The biggest thing that happened there in recent years was that horrible mass murder of a whole family in several houses close by, at Piketon, pretty much a feud-type thing gone horribly wrong. It just barely fell into Pike County, at the point where Pike, Adams, and Scioto counties meet, and stations from all three markets, Columbus, Cincinnati, and Charleston-Huntington, were there covering it.
Why? Parkersburg has 3 of the Big 4 + CW + MyNetwork/MeTv. The only net they don't have is ABC. Plus I'm sure Gray likes having a monopoly in the OTA market (much like they do in Mankato, MN, Presque Isle, ME and Harrisonburg, WV).
This isn't like WHAG, WMGM or KENV where there was another NBC in the DMA. As long as the owner (now Marqee Broadcasting) wants to continue carrying NBC I'm sure NBC would oblige.
Highly unlikely Nielsen would combine markets anymore. With the option of adding networks via low powered stations or subchannels never would happen.
The only reason Minneapolis stations cared about Mankato is what **use** to happen around here normally in the next week or so which was MN Vikings training camp. But 4 years ago the Vikings built a place in the Minneapolis area for them to hold training camp.
The situation in Parkersburg is kind of contrived (as it is in Harrisonburg, Presque Isle, Alpena, Lima, and I'm assuming, Mankato) where they are able to create the appearance of having several stations, but in reality, there is only one, with only one newsroom, and "fake" network affiliates created by using subchannels and O&O LPTVs. Put another way, there's no competition, and you only have one newscast, and one editorial point of view. It's really a return to the day of multi-network or all-network affiliates made easier by being able to run the full schedule of each network on subchannels, which didn't exist in analog days.
I see what you are saying, but I am just thinking that, for instance, NBC might want to expand the Columbus market, and do a huge favor to WCMH, by pulling the NBC affiliation from WHIZ, in effect telling them "if you can get ABC, CBS, or Fox to affiliate with you --- in spite of the fact that they probably have no desire to dilute the audience of their Columbus affiliates either --- go right ahead, and if you end up only being able to affiliate with something like Comet or TBD, then as far as keeping a separate market, more power to you". People in Muskingum County aren't going to quit watching NBC via WCMH. True, that would be throwing a loyal affiliate under the bus, but that's precisely what they did with WHAG, WMGM, and KENV.
Yes, the markets are probably pretty much etched in stone at this point, and it's only rarely that a county flips anymore. Forced carriage of only one market's stations pretty much erects an electronic Iron Curtain where cable and dish viewers are concerned. Just look at the Myrtle Beach-Florence SC market. The Wilmington and Charleston stations just disappeared, even though they are easily received with rooftop antennas due to the coastal terrain. At one time, Horry County was actually part of the Wilmington DMA.
I wish we could be part of the Parkersburg-Marietta DMA instead of the Wheeling (WV)/Steubenville, Ohio one. We live about 35 miles from Parkersburg, where we do the majority of our shopping, whereas Wheeling is at least 50 miles north, and Steubenville even further up the Ohio River. if we were less than 5 miles further south, we would be golden.
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I'm assuming you're a satellite subscriber. Yes, they're pretty strict about county boundaries, and sometimes people on the edges of a market get stiffed by that. One of the prime examples, and I've noted this here several times, is Lewis County KY, which probably should be in the Lexington (or, failing that, Cincinnati) market, but they fall into Charleston-Huntington, and to add insult to injury, their cable feed, which comes out of Portsmouth, carries C-H and, not Lexington, not Cincinnati, but Columbus. I would bet good money, nobody from Lewis County ever goes to Columbus to shop, go to college (unless they got an OSU scholarship or something), go to a sporting event, or anything like that. Sometimes people just get stuck with bad TV station choices.
Welcome to small market news. Mankato doesn't hide the fact that Gray owns the CBS, FOX, NBC and CW. Their ID is KEYC News Now and shows all 4 logos below it. Everything they ID is KEYC (network). The news is pretty much the same regardless of when you watch it and they do simulcast
morning news from 5:30-7 on CBS & NBC
rerun of said news on FOX from 7-8:30 (this wasnt the case until the Doctors and Good Dish got cancelled)
news at noon on CBS
news at 5 on CBS
news at 6 on CBS & NBC
news at 9 on FOX
news at 10 on CBS & FOX
rerun of 10pm news at 12:37 on CBS & NBC
when there is a simulcast there are different commercials. NBC is mainly the "national" type commercials whereas CBS is local businesses. With cable we still get all the Minneapolis stations as they are sig viewed. Satellite gets ABC from Minneapolis so there is at least another view. If you are OTA or streaming there is no other option (on streaming....at least on YTTV and Hulu the ABC is a hybrid of national shows and their ABC News Channel during the non national times. There is no local news on it).
In Mankato, Harrisonburg and Presque Isle Gray took a translator of the main station and converted it to a low powered station for their extra networks (NBC in all 3 casses)
We discussed this previously. You are comparing apples to coconuts. Zanesville is its own DMA. Hagerstown is in the DC DMA and Wildwood is in the Philly DMA. The NBC's in those markets are owned by Comcast/NBC so all they had to do to WMGM and WHAG is what they did. "Hey when the contract is coming up we are not going to allow you to renew it"
Unless Nielsen folds Zanesville into Columbus (doubt it...its been this way for almost 80 years) it wont happen. Also we're talking one county and NBC Columbus is on cable there.
satellite has different rules than cable. Satellite is cut and dry. If there is a affiliate assigned to the DMA no other station can be imported. simple as that.
Cable has rules from the 70s with significantly viewed. That is why in Mankato we have all 4 nets from Minneapolis on cable even though 3 of the 4 nets are local to Mankato. Gray Communications can invoke Syndex on the cable company to force blackouts on duplicate programming on out of market stations but the only one Consolidated does is overlay KEYC CBS over WCCO on the SD channel only. I think Spectrum does it on CBS & FOX. United Communications (KEYC"s former owner) had submitted something to the FCC 6 years ago to try and get WCCO and KAAL (ABC Austin/Rochester, MN) off of cable in Mankato due to Syndex and duplication rules but WCCO is still on and KAAL is still on Spectrum (Consolidated does not carry it)
But in a lot of areas cable is removing the duplicate networks due to $$$
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Yes, I recall the conversation, my point here is that, despite Zanesville being its own DMA, you have the anomalous situation of a small NBC affiliate being almost completely enveloped by a much larger market that has a major NBC affiliate. (FWIW, WHAG was at one time its own Hagerstown market, for a short time.) I have to think, then, that it is more like comparing Granny Smiths to Golden Delicious. NBC could, as they did with KENV (KSL, unlike WCAU and WRC, is not owned by NBC), refuse to renew the affiliation, and unless WHIZ could affiliate with another major network --- that'd be a crapshoot, they'd essentially be cannibalizing the viewership of their Columbus and Wheeling affiliates --- they'd be left high and dry, not unlike WKPT in Kingsport TN when they lost ABC.
Then Nielsen would be in the weird situation of having a DMA whose only station is affiliated with, let's say, Decades or Dabl. (With all the diginets nowadays, they could easily find some network, only problem is, unless it were something like MeTV, or I would say Cozi, but they're NBC, their viewership would be in the toilet.) Would Nielsen then uphold a separate Zanesville DMA? I tend to doubt it. If Muskingum County were folded into Columbus, you have the Columbus DMA increasing by 86,000 people, being bumped up two and possibly three places in the rankings. Then WHIZ could become another Columbus market station, maybe move and/or directionalize their transmitter further to the west, and/or possibly even become a satellite of WSYX or WBNS in the way that WTTK in Kokomo IN is a satellite of WTTV. You'd then have a case of a rising tide lifting all boats, including possibly even WHIZ itself. The only bad part is that, unless WHIZ could work out some kind of semi-satellite relationship with local news cut-ins, Zanesville would become yet one more TV news desert.
You're sure about this?
I wonder how many people can receive WBTW with an antenna in Myrtle given that is actually on Channel 13.
Again we're dealing with different situations with multiple affiliates in a DMA with WHAG and WMGM. The SLC/Elko sitation is because the market is Salt Lake City. So while KSL is not an O&O they still had the clout. Zanesville is its own DMA. So while they are an "island" (just the one county) unless NBC doesnt want to renew with them there is nothing anybody (any station) outside of Zanesville can do. Looking at the public files I can;'t find anything past 2019 that says they renewed with NBC. Looks like its a 3 year agreement they had that ran until 12/31/19. So since they are NBC I **assume** it runs until end of year 2022. Their Cozi affiliation (again the most current on file) said it ended March 2022. Marquee does have another NBC station (WKNY Bowling Green, KY)
WKPT lost their ABC affiliation due to it being locally owned. ABC wanted a station that is a coroprate station so when retrans time came about there was some "clout"...great example is with WHIZ being locally owned they havent been on Dish for 3 years now. With Marquee owning them now maybe Dish will carry them. Directv does carry WHIZ.
Thats based on a fabricated thought that NBC would leave WHIZ TV. NBC is the only net with affiliations in all 210 DMA's
Also the Zanesville DMA is only 27,000 people and not 86000 (this is according to Nielsen)
204 Zanesville 27,650
unless Marquee sells to a owner that has a location in Columbus it won't happen.
WTTK is a satellite of WTTV due to transmitter location back in the analog days.
But I thought this topic was "Local Newscasts available over the internet". It seems we have gone off topic.
Just as well, the discussion has pretty much run its course anyway. Final points I would make:
- I was going off of population for all of Muskingum County (86K per Wikipedia). But I did make the error of thinking that the list I provided ( Latest Nielsen DMA Rankings | Lyons Broadcast PR ) counted total populations instead of TV homes. That 86K population distills down into 32K TV homes.
- As long as WHIZ can keep a network affiliation, they are probably a viable entity, after all, businesses that aren't turning a profit don't stay in business long, and they've been around awhile. If they didn't have local news, people would have to watch either Columbus or Wheeling for news. I'd say people in Zanesville like having that newscast. And WHIZ serves more than just Muskingum County.
- It would be pretty Machiavellian of NBC to take it upon themselves to annihilate a DMA (by forcing WHIZ into an untenable position of not having a major-network affiliation), and as I said, things seem to be working well enough as it is. Ohio also has two other small infill markets (Lima and Parkersburg-Marietta, WTAP has always had a strong Marietta identity). WAKR in Akron, while never having its own ADI/DMA, seems always to have been the Charlie Brown of ABC affiliates, they never could quite become a player, never had over 49% viewership even in Summit County. Evidently Cleveland, and WEWS in particular, were just too big and too close. It may just be in the nature of that part of the country for long-standing small-town infill markets to continue to exist. Lafayette IN is another case in point, and of course there's Alpena.
- As I've noted before, I am a strong advocate for local news, and I'm always pleased when a small town and its neighbors enjoy local product, even if the station doesn't have the resources, and has the look and feel of, well, small-town news. It meets a need. Examples would be WAGM in Presque Isle ME, WHSV in Harrisonburg VA, WYMT in Hazard KY, and WHKY in Hickory NC. And then there was KXGN in Glendive MT, as low-budget as it gets, but still, as I said, it met a need. Kind of unfortunate to have to put that in the past tense. Here's what it looked like:
Got to wonder what it would be like, for small towns all over the US to have news like that.
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With a fairly decent antenna, it's possible, but it's tougher than getting Wilmington or Charleston. For some reason, all those swamps and low-lying areas aren't kind to TV signals if you have just a mediocre antenna. I know that WFXB (transmitter near Mullins SC) had issues along those lines.
And, yes, at one time Horry County was part of the Wilmington DMA, WWAY even had an office in the Flatiron building in downtown MB (such as it is), and WSFX had a sales office there. (I took a resume to WSFX there one time, in search of a sales position, mid-1990s.)
Here's the Broadcasting Yearbook from 1982. Horry County flipped to Florence the following year:
Isn't some of the small town newscasts hubbed in another place at this point. That means that their anchors and studio staff would be in a different part of the country but the "Multimedia Journalists", producers, editors and News Director would be in the respective cities doing segments for the station. It's like voice tracking but for TV.
Note I remember hearing similar stuff most notably in the case of Paramounts CBS Owned stations division the KSTW Seattle operations were hubbed and voice tracked in San Francisco from the KPIX/KBCW offices.
Three CBS owned CWs adding ‘remotely produced’ late newscasts
Click to read the full story
www.mixdexhq.com
Or KTVT Dallas they were notable for having their news staff produce news not only in Dallas, also they were notable for producing newscasts for Detroit from past cases.
TV station in Toledo outsources most work
There will be new faces on the WNWO-TV, Channel 24, news team after the first of the year. And they won’t be broadcasting from Toledo. In a cost-cutting ...
www.toledoblade.com
Anchors away: WNWO, Channel 24, airs newscasts from Indiana
After decades of past failures and ratings irrelevance in the Toledo market, WNWO-TV, Channel 24, unveiled its new-look, not-always-local newscast on ...
www.toledoblade.com
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Isn't some of the small town newscasts hubbed in another place at this point. That means that their anchors and studio staff would be in a different part of the country but the "Multimedia Journalists", producers, editors and News Director would be in the respective cities doing segments for the station. It's like voice tracking but for TV.
Note I remember hearing similar stuff most notably in the case of Paramounts CBS Owned stations division the KSTW Seattle operations were hubbed and voice tracked in San Francisco from the KPIX/KBCW offices.
Three CBS owned CWs adding ‘remotely produced’ late newscasts
Click to read the full story
Or KTVT Dallas they were notable for having their news staff produce news not only in Dallas, also they were notable for producing newscasts for Detroit from past cases.
TV station in Toledo outsources most work
There will be new faces on the WNWO-TV, Channel 24, news team after the first of the year. And they won’t be broadcasting from Toledo. In a cost-cutting ...
Anchors away: WNWO, Channel 24, airs newscasts from Indiana
After decades of past failures and ratings irrelevance in the Toledo market, WNWO-TV, Channel 24, unveiled its new-look, not-always-local newscast on ...
I don't know what WHIZ does about its newscasts, whether it is local "home-brewed" content, or whether some or all of the newscast is done somewhere else. Given WHIZ's history and long-standing status in its community, I suspect it is all local.
I also don't know to what extent local viewers would accept a "piped-in" newscast, with local multimedia content inserted into a feed from somewhere else, as being truly "local". WOLO tried that at one point, after a fashion, using fellow Bahakel station WCCB's news set with the anchors actually being in Charlotte. It felt very "fake" and I have to think that Columbia-area viewers, who have a very strong sense of "local" to begin with, were able to see right through this --- "this isn't really Columbia news" --- and didn't cotton to it. WOLO has since relocated their news operations to Columbia, including a "super-secret" attempt (we've discussed this over on AVS Forum at some length) to set up a newsroom using the former facilities of Ion affiliate WZRB (which is basically a full-powered satellator, no local content) just down the road from their Shakespeare Road location. The studios, in a dodgy part of town to begin with, are ringed with a barbed-wire fence and give no indication, other than news vehicles with "ABC Columbia" on them, parked outside the building, that WOLO has anything to do with the place.
I do remember all the channels we could receive fit on a business card. Can you believe it? Two were Wilmington, one was Florence and three were Charleston. We even got WIS in Columbia. This must have been cable. Three other channels had FM music. I don't think the card mentioned NOAA, where the video was a camera going back and forth showing temperature, humidity, barometer and wind speed and direction, and ads for Deer Track Villas ("Join us for a cool sip.").
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