610 KILT Downgrades

[b-turner]

Well, Engineering, that's too bad. Obviously you know so much including my success and failures. Actually, if you really knew what you were taking about, you'd know the situation at KYND. You do know I did not own KYND. Really appreciate he personal attack.

 

[DavidEduardo]

I think News 92 FM, as well as KNWS Channel 51 before it, failed is because it wasn't properly funded and managed. Plus, you can't offer a duplicate of what is currently available, but instead an alternative. CNN succeeded, because it was proply funded and managed, and offered an alternative to the news coverage of the networks. Foxnews succeeded because it offered an alternative to CNN. Newsmax, Real America's Voice, Blaze TV, and The First succeeded because they offer an alternative to Foxnews, CNN, and the network newscasts. They are all news/talk, but offer something different, something that the others don't offer.

But in the last two decades, neither Fox nor CNN have been news channels. They are talk and commentary channels. And the newcomers have, with no exception, not succeeded economically.

 

[Engineering]

But in the last two decades, neither Fox nor CNN have been news channels. They are talk and commentary channels. And the newcomers have, with no exception, not succeeded economically.

There re radio stations in Houston and Southeast Texas that play continuous, commercial-free music. I can cite two examples, both on the AM broadcast band. Apparently succeeding economically is no longer an objective of broadcasting.

 

[Engineering]

Well, Engineering, that's too bad. Obviously you know so much including my success and failures. Actually, if you really knew what you were taking about, you'd know the situation at KYND. You do know I did not own KYND. Really appreciate he personal attack.

No personal attack, Bill. Just a casual observation of the state of AM radio. Don't shoot the messenger.

 

[b-turner]

Actually my owners turned down every properly qualified client I brought them for 3 years. My count was 26. Their Dad would have taken any of these. He wasn't scared of losing $1,000 or $2,000 a month with a new client because he could make it back within a year to 18 months. We did really well for years (about 30% profit or more). Simply put, my owners wanted about 30-40% more for KYND than anybody was paying in the market. And they rejected the idea of a translator.

 

[Engineering]

Actually my owners turned down every properly qualified client I brought them for 3 years. My count was 26. Their Dad would have taken any of these. He wasn't scared of losing $1,000 or $2,000 a month with a new client because he could make it back within a year to 18 months. We did really well for years (about 30% profit or more). Simply put, my owners wanted about 30-40% more for KYND than anybody was paying in the market. And they rejected the idea of a translator.

That's a typical problem, not just in the Houston market, but with most markets. The station ownership and station management are often on opposite sides of the spectrum.

 

[stan]

Would regular HD Radios pick up AM HD stations or is that a whole different device?

And they should pick up those broadcasting in digital HD MA3 as well.

 

[HTX]

And they should pick up those broadcasting in digital HD MA3 as well.

Yes. All existing HD radios should pick it up. I got all digital WWFD in the DC area with both of my portables. They’ve tested an enhanced MA3 mode with HD2 but apparently that requires a new radio.

 

[Engineering]

And they should pick up those broadcasting in digital HD MA3 as well.

From what I understand, unlike the proprietary IBOC HD Radio, iBiquity Digital Corporation is licensing the MA3 format entirely royalty-free. If this is indeed true, and the MA3 Digital AM radio format is completely compatible with the existing HD consumer receivers, then this should be a significant boost for the future of Digital AM, which I for one believe is a significant boost for the future of AM radio.

 

[DavidEduardo]

From what I understand, unlike the proprietary IBOC HD Radio, iBiquity Digital Corporation is licensing the MA3 format entirely royalty-free. If this is indeed true, and the MA3 Digital AM radio format is completely compatible with the existing HD consumer receivers, then this should be a significant boost for the future of Digital AM, which I for one believe is a significant boost for the future of AM radio.

Nobody is buying stand-alone radios of any kind. And for MA3 to achieve adequate penetration in cars for a station to achieve significant and salable audience levels would be a decade or more away.

 

[stan]

While most of our vehicles have had HD radios in recent years, finding a radio to listen at home is another matter.

 

[Engineering]

Nobody is buying stand-alone radios of any kind. And for MA3 to achieve adequate penetration in cars for a station to achieve significant and salable audience levels would be a decade or more away.

This is the old chicken-and-egg delimma. Not enough people are buying eggs because there are too few chickens producing them. To translate in broadcastese, there aren't enough HD radios out there, particularly in cars, and therefore there are too few stations featuring HD subcarriers. The ones who are, are mostly squandering the choice that HD promised, by offering simulcasts of other, local stations, such as KTRH in Houston, or primary feeds for translators. There are exceptions, of course, such as Univision, who was rebroadcasting their powerhouse Tejano station in San Antonio on one of 102.9's HD channels.

There are actually four AM stations broadcasting Digital AM: WWFD (Frederick, MD), WMGG (Tampa, FL), WFAS (White Plains, NY), and WSRO (Ashland, MA). WTAW 1620 in College Station, TX is broadcasting in digital, however I understand it is as an IBOC HD subcarrier in addition to their analog carrier, and not in MA# like the four mentioned above.

WWFD began operating in an all-digital format in 2018 under an experimental authorization, which led to a rule change by the Commission in 2020 to allow for all-digital operation of AM radio stations on a voluntary basis.

 

[DavidEduardo]

The ones who are, are mostly squandering the choice that HD promised, by offering simulcasts of other, local stations, such as KTRH in Houston, or primary feeds for translators. There are exceptions, of course, such as Univision, who was rebroadcasting their powerhouse Tejano station in San Antonio on one of 102.9's HD channels.

Your argument fails totally right there. Univision moved its Tejano format from a full Class C FM to 1350, a dreadfully directional AM and an HD channel because the format was dead, but there was considerable "old guard" defense of it by powerful political voices in San Antonio.

The format for many years was, first, a 35 and over format, then a 45 and over format and, towards the end, a 55 and over format that did not sell much in the way of advertising. The only reason to keep it on any frequency was to avoid politicized objections to the company by some traditional community leaders.

The 1350 frequency has been sold to the Soros-financed news and talk network scheduled to begin sometime next year.

 

[HTX]

This is the old chicken-and-egg delimma. Not enough people are buying eggs because there are too few chickens producing them.

I think all digital AM could be good for some smaller stations. Especially music stations that have a legal translator. I doubt too many people would be listening to the AM signal at home if they can be listening on FM or a stream. I don’t think some big stations like KTRH should be digital because they’re on an FM HD subchannel.

WMGG (Tampa, FL)

WTAW 1620 in College Station, TX is broadcasting in digital,

Fairly recently, WMGG isn’t broadcasting digitally anymore. And you’re correct about WTAW. They aren’t all digital.

 

[Engineering]

Your argument fails totally right there. Univision moved its Tejano format from a full Class C FM to 1350, a dreadfully directional AM and an HD channel because the format was dead, but there was considerable "old guard" defense of it by powerful political voices in San Antonio.

The format for many years was, first, a 35 and over format, then a 45 and over format and, towards the end, a 55 and over format that did not sell much in the way of advertising. The only reason to keep it on any frequency was to avoid politicized objections to the company by some traditional community leaders.

The 1350 frequency has been sold to the Soros-financed news and talk network scheduled to begin sometime next year.

Actually, it was the other way around. KCOR was San Antonio's first Spanish-language radio station licensed by Raoul Cortez in 1946, and yes indeed it aired Tejjano and Regional Mexican formats at a time when AM was the dominant format and FM was just an infant learning to crawl. Univision acquired it in 2003, and flipped to Spanish-language sports in 2017. Tejano had moved on to the 100,000-watt blowtorch KXTN 107.5, and that was the station being simulcast in Houston on 102.9 HD. Of course, KXTN is now KVBH and has flipped from Tejano to Spanish-language Adult Contemporary in yet another format change.

As for "old guard" community leader objections, I think that had more to do with the legacy of KCOR 1350. I'm sure Univision was looking at the monetary value of the station rather than the historical significance, which is probably the reason for the format flips. Someone once said not all of those who wander are really lost, but I don't think that applies in Univision's case.

 

[Engineering]

I think all digital AM could be good for some smaller stations. Especially music stations that have a legal translator. I doubt too many people would be listening to the AM signal at home if they can be listening on FM or a stream. I don’t think some big stations like KTRH should be digital because they’re on an FM HD subchannel.




Fairly recently, WMGG isn’t broadcasting digitally anymore. And you’re correct about WTAW. They aren’t all digital.

I think it's back to the chicken and the egg. Broadcasting fully-digital would reduce their audience share significantly. There are far fewer HD radios out there. I think WTAW has the right idea, at least at this point in time.

Music stations would benefit the most by Digital AM. News/Talk stations probably not. The frequency response of AM is particularly tailored for that format. However, from a listener standpoint, if I had the choice of listening to music on AM as opposed to FM, I would choose FM because it sounds so much better. With Digital AM, the frequency response of the music program service would equal that of FM, which would definitely be a win.

If WMGG has dropped digital in favor of analog, I suspect the reason was monetary. A trailblazer must have deep pockets to support his trailblazing.

 

[DavidEduardo]

Actually, it was the other way around. KCOR was San Antonio's first Spanish-language radio station licensed by Raoul Cortez in 1946, and yes indeed it aired Tejjano and Regional Mexican formats at a time when AM was the dominant format and FM was just an infant learning to crawl. Univision acquired it in 2003, and flipped to Spanish-language sports in 2017. Tejano had moved on to the 100,000-watt blowtorch KXTN 107.5, and that was the station being simulcast in Houston on 102.9 HD. Of course, KXTN is now KVBH and has flipped from Tejano to Spanish-language Adult Contemporary in yet another format change.

Around 1990, John Tenaglia's TK Communications bought an AM (1310) and FM (107.5) in San Antonio. They put Tejano on the AM because that was a "low class" format, and they put international pop on the FM. To their total surprise, the AM debuted with better ratings than the FM. So they switched formats, and KXTN went to #1 in the market.

KXTN at that time had nothing to do with the Tichenor/Heftel/HBC/Univision ownership chain which exists to this day. Tichenor bought TAK's stations in 1993 when 2/2 per market duopoly ownership was allowed and they then became part of the merger with Heftel in 1996 and the renaming to HBC and the total sale to Perenchio and Univision in 2002.

Tichenor did own KCOR, but it was a variety and mostly talk station after FM took over in the early 90's. I changed it to all talk in 1998

The 107.5 FM Tejano format under the Tichenor to HBC to Univision chain constantly declined in audience, and it never gained a younger audience as the Tejano core aged out.

As for "old guard" community leader objections, I think that had more to do with the legacy of KCOR 1350.

No, it did not. The Tejano format had become a "big name" for San Antonio, which for years was the home of the Tejano Awards ceremony and many indie record labels and recording operations. The old guard of the Tejano crowd defended the music quite loudly.

I'm sure Univision was looking at the monetary value of the station rather than the historical significance

Radio is a business, not a museum.

... which is probably the reason for the format flips. Someone once said not all of those who wander are really lost, but I don't think that applies in Univision's case.

KCOR's biggest problem, besides being AM, was that its signal was outgrown by the market. As the Hispanic population grew outwards in all directions, the signal could not reach the population. In the later 90's we went all-talk using the model of KTNQ / KALA / WOJO and others. As hard as I tried, I could not get the signal impaired KCOR to move the needle at all.

 

[Theater of My Mind]

Music stations would benefit the most by Digital AM.

I've heard all-digital AM. It's not great. Wider frequency response than analog AM obviously, but grainy and swishy sounding. Brittle...fatiguing...still cuts out in problematic signal areas.

No one but the geekiest radio geek is going to tune into a digital HD AM radio station to listen to music. People seeking new entertainment options are moving to streaming. Everyone has a smartphone. An in-dash system that supports Android Auto and Apple Carplay is the hot entertainment item in vehicles, and has been for a few years now. Once you've experienced that, it really kills any motivation to go back to the AM/FM radio.

News/Talk stations probably not. The frequency response of AM is particularly tailored for that format.

You're right but I don't think "tailored" is quite the the right word. "Butchered," perhaps.