Oldies Fans what about Shortwave?

WTWW 5.085 MHz plays a really good mix of oldies just about every night (Wednesday night they run some programs geared to Ham Radio operators) with one of their 100KW transmitters in Lebanon, Tennessee. Those of us who remember listening to far off AM stations via the night time sky wave can do it once more thanks to WTWW.

Mike

WRMI also airs oldies shows on 9395. The problem with WTWW is that, while they air an excellent oldies show, they overly pander to the bible bangers as well to the relatively few ham operators like myself that listen.

They also sign off abruptly, with no ID whatsoever, just after 0500 UTC. I think we know now where the (in)famous Phoenix lamptimer went.

Although I still have to ask: Since when did the FCC authorize the 60 meter band for broadcast use?

KeithE4 said:

Although I still have to ask: Since when did the FCC authorize the 60 meter band for broadcast use?

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is that the FCC's call or the ITU's?

CTListener said:

is that the FCC's call or the ITU's?

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FCC or ITU it's the best thing we've had on Shortwave since WRNO and KUSW.

The big question is....Isn't there an FCC rule that says US domestic shortwave stations are prohibited from targeting a domestic audience?

Lots of FCC rules get bent and broken these days. I for one don't mind if this one gets overlooked. It sure beats the Bible thumping.

Mike Sheridan said:

FCC or ITU it's the best thing we've had on Shortwave since WRNO and KUSW.

The big question is....Isn't there an FCC rule that says US domestic shortwave stations are prohibited from targeting a domestic audience?

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Only the ones run by the government, I believe. Besides, a station that programs preaching and music can always say it's doing so to reach overseas listeners. How could the FCC prove that it isn't, since there are fans of oldies and people receptive to a Christian message all over the world?

CTListener said:

Only the ones run by the government, I believe. Besides, a station that programs preaching and music can always say it's doing so to reach overseas listeners. How could the FCC prove that it isn't, since there are fans of oldies and people receptive to a Christian message all over the world?

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It would be interesting to see just where people are listening.

I have been surprised by some of the music selections. Having started out at an Oldies station in 1972 not to mention growing up on the stuff they manage to occasionally play a song or two I've never heard. A disc-covery if you will (groan). A few nights ago they played a really nice song by Ruby & The Romantics called "My Summer Love" (#16 in '63 #6 AC). I swear I never heard it before.

Mike Sheridan said:

It would be interesting to see just where people are listening..

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At this point, I'd be very surprised if the number listening at any one time worldwide reaches even the low four digits, although with so few broadcasters still using shortwave, there are fewer options for whatever SWLs remain.Maybe there are still places in English-speaking Africa or in the Caribbean in which American evangelical shortwavers still have a following, you never know. Domestically, I suppose the lineup of preachers may get a few listeners, as would the oldies, but there are so many religious broadcasters doing the same thing just about everywhere in this country on AM or FM that the likelihood of SW reaching a significant number of ears is remote.

CTListener said:

is that the FCC's call or the ITU's?

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It's the FCC's. 47 CFR 73.701(a) defines an international broadcasting station as follows:

FCC 73.701(a) said:

International broadcast stations. A broadcasting station employing frequencies allocated to the broadcasting service between 5900 and 26100 kHz, the transmissions of which are intended to be received directly by the general public in foreign countries. (A station may be authorized more than one transmitter.) There are both Federal and non-Federal Government international broadcast stations; only the latter are licensed by the Commission and are subject to the rules of this subpart.

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73.788(a) sez:

FCC 73.788(a) said:

A licensee of an international broadcast station shall render only an international broadcast service which will reflect the culture of this country and which will promote international goodwill, understanding, and cooperation. Any program solely intended for and directed to an audience in the continental United States does not meet the requirements for this service.

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As far as frequency allocations in the US go, that's under 2.106. The 60 meter band (4750-5060 kHz) is not allocated for broadcasting in the US. It is allocated for non-government Maritime, Aviation, and Private Land Mobile use, plus government Fixed services. Similar allocations exist in the bands between 5060 and 5900 kHz, with a small, restricted ham band in there, shared with the military. But there are American broadcasters not only in the 60 meter band and some frequencies above it, but also in the 5700-5900 kHz segment below the "official" start of 49 meters. There are also US broadcasters in the 90 meter band (3200-3400 kHz) that technically aren't supposed to be there.

But since nobody has raised a stink, the FCC won't do anything about it.

Well, old rock 'n' roll certainly reflects the culture of the United States, at least as of 40 to 60 years ago, but does evangelical preaching? Or is anything even loosely tied to Christianity protected from this statute?

CTListener said:

Only the ones run by the government, I believe. Besides, a station that programs preaching and music can always say it's doing so to reach overseas listeners. How could the FCC prove that it isn't, since there are fans of oldies and people receptive to a Christian message all over the world?

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Actually, wrong.

Directly from the mouth of a shortwave radio station owner to me:



What the rules say is that we can't broadcast a program intended exclusively for a continental US audience. So I think you could say that it is legal for us to broadcast to the US, but not exclusively to the US. As a practical matter though, the FCC does not allow us to list US zones in our official target areas. We have to beam to ITU target zones (what are called CIRAF zones) that are outside the United States.

The gov't KNOWS what frequencies they're on. As I understand it, SW broadcasters pay a Frequency Usage Fee for every frequency they're on. That's what I picked up from Allan Weiner (WBCQ 7490) during his program Allan Weiner Worldwide.
I think the FCC is more focused on keeping interference to a minimum between broadcasters and the military and others with whom they share some bands.
Although I ocassionally hear OTH radar on top of commercial SW broadcasters who have been on those frequencies for years.

kf4rca said:

The gov't KNOWS what frequencies they're on. As I understand it, SW broadcasters pay a Frequency Usage Fee for every frequency they're on. That's what I picked up from Allan Weiner (WBCQ 7490) during his program Allan Weiner Worldwide.
I think the FCC is more focused on keeping interference to a minimum between broadcasters and the military and others with whom they share some bands.
Although I ocassionally hear OTH radar on top of commercial SW broadcasters who have been on those frequencies for years.

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The notorious "Russian Woodpecker"? I thought that thing shut down after the Soviet Union dissolved.

The Russian Woodpecker is actually located near the old Chernobyl nuclear site. It's in the danger zone and has been pretty much abandoned since the fire at the nuclear plant many years ago. There are lots of video and pictures of the site on the internet. It's huge

Modern OTH does not sound like the Russian Woodpecker. Its a more rapid pulse train lasting for 3 seconds or so. And then silence. It may even be from domestic military sources.
For you oldies fans out there. The mighty KBC has a Saturday night oldies show from 8-10PM (ET) on 5960. (They may be shifting to their summer frequency of 9925 soon.)
They play mainly 60's rock and roll with many jingles and sounders. Mostly European and American artists with some classic Motown in there as well. The jocks are former Euro-pirate announcers. The commercials are mostly in English but I have heard one Dutch spot in there.
They broadcast from Nauen, Germany with 125KW power. So they get into the Eastern US quite easily.
Believe the transmitter is a Telefunken model.

CTListener said:

Well, old rock 'n' roll certainly reflects the culture of the United States, at least as of 40 to 60 years ago, but does evangelical preaching? Or is anything even loosely tied to Christianity protected from this statute?

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I'm always reminded of Aimee Semple McPherson.

Occasionally I have listened to WTWW's signal, and like the fact that the station plays more than the usual preaching. I have fond memories of WRNO, superpower KUSW, and KYOI (Saipan) playing pop/rock on short wave. Radio Luxembourg's services on 6090 and 15350 were others I enjoyed as well.

Over the past few years, some countries have altered their rules, or at least have allowed lower powered short wave broadcasters to broadcast. Germany has a few, and Denmark has one, and Australia has a few domestic broadcasters. These tend to be community or non commercial type radio stations that play oldies or pop/rock music. Some stream online, and those that don't can be heard on remote receivers that are nearby. Have any of you listened to these?

I could see something similar to that taking place here. It would have to be more of a hobby/labor of love/community style radio station. Face it: Short wave listeners tend to be a different breed of people than AM/FM listeners, and there are fewer of us these days. It was Joe Costello of WRNO who challenged the rules regarding domestic/international broadcasting and got his station on the air. A low power SW service would be novel here. Call it "propagation research" and use digital modes like DRM or other modes that may be created. Just an idea.

SomeRadioGuy said:

Actually, wrong.

Directly from the mouth of a shortwave radio station owner to me:



What the rules say is that we can't broadcast a program intended exclusively for a continental US audience. So I think you could say that it is legal for us to broadcast to the US, but not exclusively to the US. As a practical matter though, the FCC does not allow us to list US zones in our official target areas. We have to beam to ITU target zones (what are called CIRAF zones) that are outside the United States.

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Global oldies radio. Go figure. Let The Good Times Roll, baby!

Silkie said:

Global oldies radio. Go figure. Let The Good Times Roll, baby!

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Sounds good to me!!!!
If it comes to a vote....I go with "YES!"