WMAL

WMAL was my favorite radio station.

I started listening to "Mornings on the Mall" when it was hosted by Brian Wilson and Larry O'Connor. The current hosts, Vince Colonaise and Mary Walter are a terrific.

The station, unlike Cumulus in my local area, has a vibrant roster of local advertisers - Realtors, roofers, carpet and rug cleaners, dentists, etc - generally two or three of each category competing with each other. It reminds me of radio decades ago and I think proves that good programming and a good sales department can make a radio station succeed.

But for the past several weeks, Cumulus has begun blocking the local ads on their stream. While I'm sad to see the local ads go, I don't disagree with that - in fact I've argued that streaming should be monitized through locally targeted ads.

But the problem is, the local ads are being replaced by the most annoying, intrusive, and repetitive stuff imaginable.

For instance, there's a Credit Karmam ad that repeates once, often twice, in each and every break. It's voiced by a little girl who sounds like she's delivering a junior high school commencement address. Given that WMAL's demo is at least 45+ (to be generous,) I don't think she's going to resonate with WMAL listeners.

Then there are the Dr. Sange Gupta "features" that run over and over. Gupta is CNN's chief medical correspondent who I'd say violated his Hippocratic Oath by diagnosing candidate Donald Trump with physical and mental disorders without actually examining him. It's ironic too that Chris Plante bashes CNN every chance he gets - guess we can wipe Gupta off the favorites list of the WMAL audience.

But the worst offender is the "It's All About The Conversation" promos. (Actually it's all about the money, but I digress.) These promos begin with an obnoxious squeaky-plopping sound and a voice-over that says, "Dub-Double-U_M_A_L, it’s all about the conversation." The promos are clips taken out of context and tend to make the hosts sound like jerks. They often run during the show from which the clip was taken. Do we really need to hear a promo for The Larry O'Connor show DURING The Larry O'Connor Show?

So the bottom line for me is that's I'll still check out WMAL from time to time but listening for very long is just too painful. I know that audio can be used as a form of torture - now I understand how!

wadio said:

But for the past several weeks, Cumulus has begun blocking the local ads on their stream.

Click to expand...

Are you sure Cumulus is blocking the local ads? Or if it's something else?

It's the same on their site, iHeart and TuneIn so I'm guessing it's happening at the source. The first day they tried this, about 3 weeks ago, the timing was completely off so the inserted content was cutting into the programming as well as covering only parts of the local spots. Then they stopped it for a week or so. Then one morning they ran nothing but the inserts non-stop, although I believe iHeart was not affected that time. Now they seem to have the timing right but it sure breaks the flow of the station.

wadio said:

Now they seem to have the timing right but it sure breaks the flow of the station.

Click to expand...

I may have brought this up before, but some spots are not allowed on streams because of union rules. So they have to cover the spots with something.

These days I think most audio streaming from the major station owners takes out the local ads and inserts ads just for the internet audience. Sometimes the breaks are targeted just to your region, according to your IP location. I'm taken aback when listening to a station on iHeart. I live in the NYC area and I hear NY-based advertisements even when listening to stations more than 1000 miles away.

And the Wadio is right. The spot breaks are very repetitive, with the same ads heard in every break. But I guess if in our modern world, where we now have access to radio stations across the nation and the world, we have to accept that commercial sales have not kept pace with this new technology. It probably isn't a priority for iHeart or Entercom (Radio.com) to spend too much time making sure internet listeners don't hear the same spots over and over.

The WMAL ads I used to hear were mostly local and voiced by the show hosts or the by advertisers themselves.

The AFTRA deal has been in effect for a long time. Does it apply to station personnel? I'm wondering what prompted the sudden change.

I'm told that some stations offer local advertisers the stream for a modest additional fee.

wadio said:

I'm wondering what prompted the sudden change.

Click to expand...

Several possible reasons: Policy change, a usage threshold was crossed, or a letter from AFTRA. Changes happen all the time.

As has been speculated, they may have added AFTRA-voiced spots to the OTA inventory and made the change to the stream breaks to accommodate that. I listen to ad-free streams when doing things around the house and yard. If I'm listening to an ad-supported stream, I try to be near the computer keyboard/web radio remote mute button come break time. The stream-inserted ads are repetitive and annoying - aka unlistenable. It's bad enough that I'll pre-record appointment listening on ad-laden streams so I can skip by the annoyances. I'm sure I'm not alone in this behavior.

It sounds to me as though this is primarily an issue if you listen in real time. However, all of WMAL's local hosts do podcasts, and those podcasts should have a different commercial structure. No specific ad window to fill. Have you tried the podcasts?

I'll always pick real time over podcast. Also I guess I'm not a button pusher. I like to pick a good station (stream) and keep it on. I don't mind meaningful ads as part of the bargain. .

I suspect Credit Karma bought some kind of bulk ROS at a very good price. Same with WP Kerry Business School. Wonder if that's predicated on a single spot with no spot rotation.

I don't think the concept of dropping in ads is bad. But like JBraddock says, the repetition is a killer.

Maybe if they can sell more spots things will get better.

There have been a number of threads on RadioDiscussions about this sort of issue over the years. It doesn't seem to have gotten much better as far as the variety of spots goes. I think it is really unfortunate, because the ads are an important component of the listening experience over the air.

PTBoardOp94 said:

It doesn't seem to have gotten much better as far as the variety of spots goes.

Click to expand...

What do you suggest? The time has to be filled. It sounds as though they're filling the time with both content and spots. The complaint is spot repetition. Until the stream gets enough audience, the advertiser demand will be limited. Not much anyone can do.

A company like Cumulus should have a lot of stuff they could plug in. It's not like the problem of filling time on a stream is limited to WMAL.

There's no reason they shouldn't have adverts for Per-Inquiry type companies like Stamps.com and 1-800-Flowers. Or major national clients like Progressive and Home Depot whose ads are cleared for air online. They could promote their podcasts of WMAL shows, or Westwood One shows. Also, the station promos should be updated often - at least once a week.

TheBigA said:

What do you suggest? The time has to be filled. It sounds as though they're filling the time with both content and spots. The complaint is spot repetition. Until the stream gets enough audience, the advertiser demand will be limited. Not much anyone can do.

Click to expand...

The main problem is repetition. Even a variety of annoying spots can be marginally listenable simply because the spots aren't mind-numbingly repetitive. This would require someone to cut multiple spots for a single advertiser (not likely based on limited return) or varying the advertisers/PSAs.

Since much of the spot inventory on streams is simply drop-in for little or no compensation, variety shouldn't be impossible. It would, however, require someone at the station or conglomerate, to pay some attention to programming the stream, which may be asking too much. Hence, the various forms of avoidance (mute button, record-and-skip, skipping through an audiocast).

Sadly, as more of the audience becomes captive (someone talking to a "smart" - aka data-aggregating - speaker), grating spots will probably continue to be the norm unless it can be shown that the poor quality of the spots is negatively impacting consumption.

JBraddock said:

The main problem is repetition. Even a variety of annoying spots can be marginally listenable simply because the spots aren't mind-numbingly repetitive.

Click to expand...

However, repetition is a key part of advertising. To drive home the message. I don't know of any advertisers who just buy one spot. They buy a "flight," which is a package of spots that are aimed at reaching a certain number of impressions, based on the audience of the stream. The smaller the audience, the more spots they need to buy to reach that number. So until the usage number of the stream increases, its not likely to see a change.

TheBigA said:

However, repetition is a key part of advertising. To drive home the message. I don't know of any advertisers who just buy one spot. They buy a "flight," which is a package of spots that are aimed at reaching a certain number of impressions, based on the audience of the stream. The smaller the audience, the more spots they need to buy to reach that number. So until the usage number of the stream increases, its not likely to see a change.

Click to expand...

Then create more engaging spots. There's a line between repetitive exposure and complete and permanent tune-out. Once I've identified a spot as terminally annoying, I'll never listen to it again. This may not be an issue for passive listeners, but those with control over the content they're consuming may be lost for good if the spot quality isn't improved.

When spots were live-read, the variety was built in, but that's no longer an option unless an advertiser cuts multiple spots up front.

It's a chicken and egg thing. If the repetitive spots are a result of low listenership, driving listeners away with even more repetitive spots will only make things worse.

Fortunately I'm hearing a few additional spots including Lowes! That's a good sign. And I haven't heard Gupta for a few days - do they read this board?

The Credit Karma ads should be discussed with the advertiser. When the advertiser discovers how misplaced they are, which they will in time, they will likely not trust Cumulus in the future. I used to hear Clearasil acne ads on talk streams - this is not much different given the v/o.

But I still think the most annoying issue on WMAL is the promos, and ironically they do update them every few days. It's the sloppy rifle-shot opening over and over and over that's so grating.

More engaging spots are a win-win-win for the station, the advertiser and the audience.

JBraddock said:

Then create more engaging spots. There's a line between repetitive exposure and complete and permanent tune-out.

Click to expand...

You have studies on this maybe? I suggest that advertisers know what they're doing, they know what they're buying, and they understand the results they're causing. It's up to users to adapt to the situation. I've offered a possible solution, which is to listen to station podcasts rather than real time. That solution isn't acceptable? Oh well.

wadio said:

It's a chicken and egg thing. If the repetitive spots are a result of low listenership, driving listeners away with even more repetitive spots will only make things worse.

Click to expand...

As I said above, do you have studies on this? You assume everyone is as averse to spot repetition as you. Maybe they're not.

The main job of the radio station is to create and deliver the show. That's what they're responsible for. You like the show, but you don't like the means of paying for it. I've offered a solution, but that's unacceptable to you. The spots, as you say, are the cost of doing business.

TheBigA said:

It's up to users to adapt to the situation.

Click to expand...

That's pretty arrogant, don't you think?

I've offered a possible solution, which is to listen to station podcasts rather than real time. That solution isn't acceptable? Oh well.

Click to expand...

Pfff! Blow off the listener. Good strategy! Kodak probably felt the same about people who they didn't want to adapt to digital photography.

You assume everyone is as averse to spot repetition as you. Maybe they're not.

Click to expand...

Fair enough.

You like the show, but you don't like the means of paying for it.

Click to expand...

Precisely. And I wouldn't mind paying for it if two conditions were met:

- Less repetitive content in the breaks.
- Universal access to all US broadcast stations without requiring different apps and with no third party info sharing, preroll ads, etc.