Should WABC Go to Oldies on the Weekends ?

The one thing that all of those call letters have in common is that none of them are playing music any more. That isn't going to change.

There's a reason why music moved to FM, and there's no good reason for it to move back.

There are lots of small oldies stations in the places that surround NYC, where most of the boomers have gone to retire.

kevtronics said:

WABC is more likely to go all-Dr. Lederman infomercials on weekends than all-Oldies.

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Maybe, Lederman can host the oldies show and also talk about his cancer patients The cancer patients bring you down and the oldiest lift you up!

I may have missed the mention of WKBW on that list of most-listened-to stations in the country. If so, my error.

'KB is now, of course, a music-free zone like all the big AM signals are. Plus, they themselves tried Oldies a decade or so ago, and wound up with ratings around the neighbourhood of 0.7 despite the huge signal.

In any case, WABC isn't going back to Oldies. We'll hear Oldies on WBBR or WMCA or WINS before we hear them on WABC. Oldies on AM has joined once-frenzied things on the attrition list.... hula hoops, saddle shoes, Thom McAn Duke shoes, slam-dancing, juke boxes, Garrison belts, etc.

Moreover, any Oldies fare resuscitated on AM would be the same-old same old dog-eared playlist. Oldies/'classic hits' stations tossed that demo on *FM* quite some time back.

Internet radio is your best bet if you want oldies. Pop Gold Radio and Rewound Radio are two excellent stations with deep playlists and specialty programs. There are other internet stations as well. There are several oldies stations on SiriusXM if you have a subscription to that service.

WABC's programming includes plenty of oldies already.

True and how would you define oldies as we head into the 2020's though. The playlists are not going to AM though its going to be on Internet Radio, Satellite and whoever is leftover on FM radio though. The Oldies Playlists would have to be 1980's to 2001 approximately? and this is beyond what the OP has in mind for airing Oldies for WABC-AM though given that their playlists were in 1960's to 1982 though.

Even KRTH Los Angeles had to include some 1980's and 1990's playlists in their Oldies format to lower the median demos though in that market.

RadioPatrol said:

True and how would you define oldies as we head into the 2020's though. The playlists are not going to AM though its going to be on Internet Radio, Satellite and whoever is leftover on FM radio though. The Oldies Playlists would have to be 1980's to 2001 approximately? and this is beyond what the OP has in mind for airing Oldies for WABC-AM though given that their playlists were in 1960's to 1982 though.

Even KRTH Los Angeles had to include some 1980's and 1990's playlists in their Oldies format to lower the median demos though in that market.

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KLUV in Dallas too. In fact, I'd say a very sizeable portion of Classic Hitters have added the 90s by now or will be very soon.

LibertyNT said:

KLUV in Dallas too. In fact, I'd say a very sizeable portion of Classic Hitters have added the 90s by now or will be very soon.

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WHCN Hartford, a classic rock/classic hits hybrid, generally plays one or two '90s tracks an hour, most recently Lenny Kravitz's "Fly Away" and Green Day's "Boulevard of Broken Dreams." Nickelback's 2002 "Someday" has gotten a spin today as well, so maybe it's time for the new millennium's first hits to become "classics." Otherwise, the playlist is late '70s/'80s-dominated -- but good old "Brown Eyed Girl" rocks on at the ripe old age of 52!

Kemosabe said:

WABC's programming includes plenty of oldies already.

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LOL!

DavidEduardo said:

WABC is one of the 25 original 1-A clear channel stations

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I always got confused with the designations, I, III, Class A, D, etc. ;-)

David, is there a reliable list of the original 1-A Clears?

What factors made them different from the 1-B's?

TheBigA said:

The one thing that all of those call letters have in common is that none of them are playing music any more.

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KIOA is....albeit having migrated to FM.

I agree with David that the probability of oldies making a return to big signal AM is nil. If I want oldies, I can get all I want online (at home AND in the car), either with streaming stations or my own custom stuff on Spotify or itunes. If I'm really feeling nostalgic, I can get recreations of classic WCFL, WFIL, and WIRL via streaming (the latter still broadcasting on AM, FM and FM-HD).

As posted previously, I had the good fortune during my college years to be within daily (and/or nightly) listening range of three Storz stations, WLS, WCFL, WABC, KIOA, KAAY, and "also excellent" stations such as WOKY, KSTT, and the aforementioned WIRL. Oh....and on top of that, I spent a year of high school living two blocks from KPOI, with a couple of their jocks living in the same apartment complex as me.

So what more could I ask for? Oh wait....maybe one thing. Is there anyplace where I could possibly find classic KPOI jingles online?

cyberdad said:

I agree with David that the probability of oldies making a return to big signal AM is nil.

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Then again, when there was music on a big signal AM, it wasn't oldies but currents.

You're asking for a recreation, and that makes no sense for an ad-supported station.

Streaming keeps getting more expensive, with publishing royalties going up 44%, and pre-1972 music now requiring full royalty payments.

The concept of free internet radio is becoming less possible.

One can’t really argue with success and WABC was the number one station in the number one market during the golden age of AM top 40.

But I always thought KHJ during the Drake era sounded 100 times better. WABC even in the early 70s seemed to have sloppy formatics, djs talking over the vocals and the weird practice (to my ears) of jingling into commercials instead of music. Cousin Brucie is a “you must have to have been there” to understand personality as I don’t get his act at all, whereas I easily get why the Real Don Steele was so highly rated.

WABC’s super tight playlist also is not nearly as interesting as KHJ which played a good percentage of LA centric records during the Drake era.

WLS under John Rook was also to me much better than WABC with a tighter sounding presentation and more interesting music mix. I also really like the Storz stations.

I’ve read before where people say KHJ was perfect for the West Coast but would’ve never worked in New York, but I’ve often wondered if RKO had put the Drake format on WOR AM, if WABC would have won that battle. I know that was never an option because WOR’s full service format was a revenue machine in the 1960s. I’ve also heard others say that within the city WMCA beat WABC in those years and that WABC only won because of signal but I have no idea if that is true.

Wimmmex said:

I always got confused with the designations, I, III, Class A, D, etc. ;-)

David, is there a reliable list of the original 1-A Clears?

What factors made them different from the 1-B's?

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The original I-A clears:

KFI, WSM, WNBC, WMAQ, KNBR, WLW, WGN, WSB, WJR, WABC, WBBM, WBAP/WFAA, WCCO, WHAS, WWL, WCBS, KDKA, WBZ, WHO, WTAM, KMOX, KSL, WHAM, WOAI, WCAU

These were originally unduplicated at night across the entire US, and had no requirement to operate directional antennas to protect any other station. (Several chose to use DAs to concentrate their signals over land instead of water or foreign soil - WBZ and WWL still do, and WNBC, WLW, WTAM and KNX experimented with DAs at various times.)

The I-Bs still enjoyed skywave protection of their signals (which would later entitle them to the same Class A status as the I-As) but were usually DA-N so as to allow several stations to share a frequency. WOR, WGY/KGO, KOA, KYW, KNX, WTIC, WBAL, WBT/KFAB are all prominent examples of I-Bs. A few of them - WGY, KOA, KNX - were far enough away from the stations with which they had mutual protection so that they could still operate ND-U. WBT is a special case because it was originally a I-A but downgraded to I-B when its then-owner CBS wanted to move KFAB in Omaha. KFAB had been synchronized to CBS-owned WBBM on 770 and then 780; downgrading WBT to I-B (and adding two more towers at night) allowed it to share the 1080/1110 channel with KFAB and got KFAB off the same channel as WBBM.

And there was a 40-year legal battle waged over WABC's I-A status. KOB in New Mexico fought to get WABC downgraded to I-B status so that it could also operate as a I-B in a region that otherwise had no powerful full-time AMs. WABC fought back, and the matter wasn't fully resolved for decades. WABC ended up as a de facto I-B, since KOB was allowed to operate at night while the court fight raged on. By the time it was resolved, even though WABC kept its nominal I-A status, the FCC had created the class II-A stations that duplicated East Coast I-A channels out west at night, and you could no longer hear the East Coast clears from coast to coast, even if they were still I-As on paper.

This one is gonna cost me, but you all can sit here in your memories and dream all you want. I wish I could too, so don't think I don't get "it." But enough. This is the 100,000th post to semi-attempt to revive what is not coming back. EVER. WABC is dead. It is a dinosaur. So is WLS and WSM. WE, the great folks on this board, cannot bring back this era. David mentions great oldies stations. WMAK was a great Top 40 station in Nashville. I had the pleasure of working there in "the day." Just as FM rolled into Top 40, 92Q came into play and many people realized the better signal of FM and went to that station, which was often a simulcast. 1300 basically crashed and burned. Talk radio has had a 25 year run and the old voices are being replaced by less prominent (more short term) voices that will not have the branding that was there ten or twenty years ago. Those streets ain't gonna be lined with easy gold. But, how many of you will admit that the best station trying to be a blast from our past, yet current, may well be WCBS-FMMMMM in NYC? Yeah, its not playing the Carpenters or even Brown Eyed Girl?. Who cares. Thank God. But, it is literally a sole survivor, brought back from the dead, with great personality and personalities that have managed to not become dinosaurs or irrelevant. Go embrace them and remember them, because there will be a day when you all will appreciate that line-up, like you did all the others that are a mere memory. Shannon, Dan Taylor, Broadway Bill Lee (I will argue the greatest long-term voice of honest radio in our lifetimes), Joe Causi and Dave Stewart. Your old WABC is there now and enjoy it while you can. Let WABC run info-whatever. Go listen, and support the jocks and the events and advertisers and do the same in your local communities with any remaining stations trying to be live and local. This biz is a tough bastard these days. The demands of listener expectations far exceed the revenues necessary, but some of us still TRY and while we wish the past could just easily come back, it just will not. Sorry, I love you all posting on here, because you are the minority that tries to keep the dream radio team alive, but man, there has to be some honest comments about where the radio dial is and is going, and WABC-AM is just not where the energy should be spent, while valid stations continue to whittle away every single day.

As for commentary on what was actually happening during the magic days of AM, the info in this post is brilliant and interesting and relevant. My comments are not intended to hurt those comments. Just more that we need not overlook some of the good ole remaining days on a few great American radio stations broadcasting today.

fybush said:

The original I-A clears:

KFI, WSM, WNBC, WMAQ, KNBR, WLW, WGN, WSB, WJR, WABC, WBBM, WBAP/WFAA, WCCO, WHAS, WWL, WCBS, KDKA, WBZ, WHO, WTAM, KMOX, KSL, WHAM, WOAI, WCAU

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What happened to WLS? Also, had it not been for its original long wire, wouldn't WOR have been a I-A clear?