I think KDKA did an experiment with this a few years ago. The biggest issue, and we also see this with HD, is that all receivers would have to be replaced. That conversion process simply takes too long.
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Is HD radio here to stay?
- Thread starter Vincent
- Start date
I think KDKA did an experiment with this a few years ago. The biggest issue, and we also see this with HD, is that all receivers would have to be replaced. That conversion process simply takes too long.
And for at home and, in the future, workplace listening, it is cheaper and in so many ways better to develop an Echo Skill for a station than to try to program to a diminishing universe of home radios... and to overall limited use of AM.
There are practically no home or workplace radios being sold. And car radios have the disadvantage of being attached to a coupla' thousand pound "enclosure" and folks keep their cars an average of 11 years today.
Then again, when was the last time an electronics manufacturer came out with an exciting new home radio, one that reinvented the device in the way the Echo did? And then launched it with a huge marketing push. The fact that it came from companies like Amazon and Google rather than traditional electronics manufacturers really says a lot.
The current batch of HD-capable receivers in cars will receive the full AM digital without the analog portion. There is still the; if a tree falls in the woods with nobody around to hear it.. question.
DRM still exists? And even if there still are a few stations using it, how many receivers are in the hands of the general public, hams being possible exceptions?
"Few?" Try just about none.
tomservo
Walk of Fame Participant
There are very few receivers out there and the ones that exist aren't cheap. But however comma, there are these things called SDRs that have exploded in popularity and you can output the raw audio to DREAM DRM decoder which is a free program and hear things that way. So in a way, there are probably a ton more DRM capable receivers out there in shortwave and ham land than there have ever been tabletop models for sale.
I use DREAM with my SDRplay RSP-1 and it works just fine. And when SW is crap I use DSD+ to decode my local PD's Nexedge digital transmissions, which most scanners still can't do. And the ones that can cost 6-700 bucks. It's amazing what these little inexpensive boxes can do.
I now know more people with AM HD capable car radios than people without HD in their cars. With a proper bit of education, I'm sure some would be willing to use the extended range of AM over a tiny little translator to listen to compelling content digitally if it was available.
Hell, it ain't no less reliable than trying to stream anything over Sprint or T-Mobile's iffy networks!
Yep, DRM is mainly used by a handful of SW stations, and I believe a couple MW ones overseas. DRM actually works really well for AM or SW. One could argue, better than the Ibquity IBOC version. Just as with ATSC for DTV, chock it up to the U.S. not-invented-here mindset.
If you're interested, here is a good technical description of how DRM works: http://www.drm.org/DRM_Implementation_Guide_2017.pdf
I wouldn't count on many HD radio streams being available online. I'd suggest a Sangean HDR-16 (around $100 online), an AM-FM stereo mini boombox with HD radio capabilities if you're interested in something reasonably affordable that has HD radio on it.
jammerdave
Leading Participant
Current list of DRM stations:
http://www.drm.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/SCHEDULES-OF-DRM-BROADCASTS-WORLDWIDE.pdf
http://www.drm.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/SCHEDULES-OF-DRM-BROADCASTS-WORLDWIDE.pdf
CTListener
Walk of Fame Participant
How badly would hams in SSB on 3955 KHz affect reception of the BBC World Service in DRM, or would they do so at all?
jammerdave
Leading Participant
CTListener
Walk of Fame Participant
I realize that, but isn't 100 kilowatts enough to get a DRM signal across the Atlantic on that frequency? Hams in Europe -- and even Africa and Asia -- can be heard lower down in the 75-meter band at night across the country, in several analog modes, running far less power, and American analog-mode hams can be heard in Region 1 as well.
Depending on the receiver, antenna, frequency, and receive location? Sure. The advantage of digital modulation over AM, is the higher carrier level from a continuous modulation, not peak. That, and because DRM is based on a OFDM digital structure, Forward Error Correction is baked into the stream.
tomservo
Walk of Fame Participant
I personally have had zero luck decoding the BBC DRM on 3955 kHz, not for lack of trying. But my antenna is centered on 7 MHz so the low bands just don't really come through as good as they do for people with bigger and better setups. I have seen some reception reports of people on the eastern seaboard hearing it occasionally. It's being beamed at 114° from Woofferton so it's aimed at eastern or central Europe best I can tell. So for anyone to hear it off the backside is pretty good luck.
Radio Romania Intl and Voice of Nigeria are our best bets for DRM in the US because they're both vaguely aimed in our direction. RRI targets western Europe so we're on the second-hop and Nigeria I think targets central and western Africa with their DRM English broadcast.
I will say that when something is actually aimed directly at us, reception is quite easy. When the HFCC met in Miami a few years ago, the Vatican threw up a test loop of audio on a DRM test transmission on 17 MHz aimed at the eastern US, for reception at the conference. I have a recording of it somewhere, the SNR was up around 22 dB, whereas the best I've gotten from "real" regular DRM from RRI is only about 17 dB and that was during unusually good atmospheric conditions, and on a much more favorable lower band.
Ah, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vi_u6cu1nA&t=54s
Not much to listen to, but a good demo of the technology and how reliable the signal is. The distance to the Santa Maria di Galeria TX site is 5300 miles from me.
Radio Romania Intl and Voice of Nigeria are our best bets for DRM in the US because they're both vaguely aimed in our direction. RRI targets western Europe so we're on the second-hop and Nigeria I think targets central and western Africa with their DRM English broadcast.
I will say that when something is actually aimed directly at us, reception is quite easy. When the HFCC met in Miami a few years ago, the Vatican threw up a test loop of audio on a DRM test transmission on 17 MHz aimed at the eastern US, for reception at the conference. I have a recording of it somewhere, the SNR was up around 22 dB, whereas the best I've gotten from "real" regular DRM from RRI is only about 17 dB and that was during unusually good atmospheric conditions, and on a much more favorable lower band.
Ah, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vi_u6cu1nA&t=54s
Not much to listen to, but a good demo of the technology and how reliable the signal is. The distance to the Santa Maria di Galeria TX site is 5300 miles from me.
jammerdave
Leading Participant
PTBoardOp94
Walk of Fame Participant
Who even are "traditional electronics manufacturers" any more? I think every one of the major radio manufacturers of decades gone by has either gone belly up or sold out to a Japanese or Korean company. And Sony or Panasonic is pretty unlikely to design an HD radio product that they know will only sell a few thousand per year, and which is only useful in the US market.
HD is now expanding in the Mexican and Canadian markets, and is in the approval process in a number of significant countries of Latin America.
I live in center city philly and all I listen to are HD sides, we have a great variety and all are pretty strong. My favorites are WMGK HD 2 Great Oldies, WOGL HD 2 great blend of 70's, WIP HD 3 Hair Bands and Active Rock, WBEB HD 2 80''s, WTDY HD 2 Alternative and Accoustic Rock, and their are other sides for country, urban, jazz, dance, talk, and others, only flaw is no Standards yet ( I would advise you to purchase a few sets.
tomservo
Walk of Fame Participant
Damn. I'd love that kind of variety down here where I live. All the Cumulus stations have shut off their HD years ago, except one (and it won't decode on my radios despite a solid signal). iHeart runs some stuff, but it's conservative talk, Christian preaching, rap music, or sports talk. Bleh. The only really unique format is smooth jazz, on two different signals.
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