College Football Division I "championship?"

joebtsflk1 · Jan 9, 2018

Here we are again, another year where the College Football Playoff ends with an asterisk champion. While Alabama beat Georgia, Auburn beat both of those teams earlier in the season, and Central Florida ended its season undefeated, beating Auburn on New Year's Day.

A four team playoff makes no sense. The results are only slightly more valid as when the wire services sportswriters arbitrarily chose a champion.

We have a whole bunch of nonsense bowls that started as early as December 16th. Why not give some of these second and third tier bowls some purpose? These bowls could trade off just like the New Year's Day bowls by hosting playoff games.

There could be a 16 team playoff system that would start mid December and end January 8th which would allow six or seven days between games. It wouldn't be that hard to implement.

The "power" conferences don't want anyone else coming in to spoil their party, though.

Mr Tony · Jan 9, 2018

joebtsflk1 said:
There could be a 16 team playoff system that would start mid December and end January 8th which would allow six or seven days between games. It wouldn't be that hard to implement.

you mean like EVERY other division does?
FCS, D2, D3 and NAIA all have playoffs of 16-24 teams

Will_H_69_9 · Jan 10, 2018

i think College Football needs a "December Madness" where instead of 4 teams, it's a very big bracket i wonder why College Football on the highest stage don't do that, also have a college football version of the NIT tournament too. and also we need to have the opening rounds set by regions, but not the regions decided by the NCAA but instead actual regions the colleges are from, like for example UCLA gets to be in the Southwest region, while University of Texas is South Central Region, Michigan is in the Midwest/North Central region, Penn State is Northeast Region, Oregon is in the Northwest region, and Alabama is in the Southeast region. and Hawaii, Alaska and other territories of the US are lumped up in a region known as "Non continental US Region" so they can get their football teams in. that would be 7 regions, but if you split Midwest and North Central US in half, you could get 8 regions but to figure out a 8 region bracket could be the hardest part. but i think if they went with a December Madness College football tournament, it could solve any controversial issues that the College Football Playoff system that is in place now and it's predecessor the BCS caused.

CTListener · Jan 10, 2018

Will_H_69_9 said:
i think College Football needs a "December Madness" where instead of 4 teams, it's a very big bracket i wonder why College Football on the highest stage don't do that, also have a college football version of the NIT tournament too. and also we need to have the opening rounds set by regions, but not the regions decided by the NCAA but instead actual regions the colleges are from, like for example UCLA gets to be in the Southwest region, while University of Texas is South Central Region, Michigan is in the Midwest/North Central region, Penn State is Northeast Region, Oregon is in the Northwest region, and Alabama is in the Southeast region. and Hawaii, Alaska and other territories of the US are lumped up in a region known as "Non continental US Region" so they can get their football teams in. that would be 7 regions, but if you split Midwest and North Central US in half, you could get 8 regions but to figure out a 8 region bracket could be the hardest part. but i think if they went with a December Madness College football tournament, it could solve any controversial issues that the College Football Playoff system that is in place now and it's predecessor the BCS caused.

The non-continental US division would be a joke. Hawaii is the only FBS school that qualifies and they'd run roughshod over Alaska-Anchorage, University of Puerto Rico and University of the Virgin Islands every year, if those schools even have football. Name a school other than Penn State, Syracuse and Boston College that wouldn't be a joke in the Northeast.

Anyway, a huge tournament like this would not work in college football because of the physical toll football takes. Teams can't play more than once a week, give or take a day or two. Certainly not on one day's rest, as teams in the NCAA basketball tournament do. The tournament would drag on and on and half the players would wind up injured. Leave the postseason the way it is. Besides, if the original poster is angry that two teams that lost to Auburn wound up in the national championship game, imagine how he'd feel if a Notre Dame or a Stanford pulled off a string of upsets in the drawn-out playoffs and wound up there!

And the OP should stop with the UCF talk, too. They play in a conference that half the schools are looking to get out of ASAP, so discount most of their regular season wins, and in their bowl they drew a team with absolutely nothing to play for that went through the motions on game day, as any bunch of similarly disappointed college players who just want to get the season over with would have done.

joebtsflk1 · Jan 10, 2018

CTListener said:
And the OP should stop with the UCF talk, too. They play in a conference that half the schools are looking to get out of ASAP, so discount most of their regular season wins, and in their bowl they drew a team with absolutely nothing to play for that went through the motions on game day, as any bunch of similarly disappointed college players who just want to get the season over with would have done.

No, I will not. Granted UCF plays in a patsy conference. But without a valid playoff, which the current CFP is not, we will be subject to these types of asterisk results on a semi-regular basis.

A large tournament just won't work for football, precisely because of the injury concerns you mention. But a 16 team playoff would definitely be doable, and it should minimize the number of unbeaten teams not invited to a four team playoff.

umfan · Jan 11, 2018

unclehonkey said:
you mean like EVERY other division does?
FCS, D2, D3 and NAIA all have playoffs of 16-24 teams

All of those Divisions play far fewer regular season games. If Div 1 was willing to give up regular season games, I'd be for such a playoff construct, but it would destroy the Bowl Game system which does provide economic benefit to the communities that host them. For the life of me, I don't see why so many people feel the need to define the Div 1 champion by a playoff. The kids who get to the CFP final play 15 games. They are supposed to be students, in case anyone has forgotten that.

Mr Tony · Jan 11, 2018

umfan said:
All of those Divisions play far fewer regular season games.

ummm tyry again
D1 has 12 games
D1AA (FCS) has 11-12
D2 plays 11
D3 plays 11

The kids who get to the CFP final play 15 games

no different than the other divisions. NDSU (North Dakota State) won the FCS championship at 14-1 and they had a bye in the 1st round.
the D2 champion went 14-1
D3 is 14 games

CTListener · Jan 11, 2018

unclehonkey said:
ummm tyry again
D1 has 12 games
D1AA (FCS) has 11-12
D2 plays 11
D3 plays 11

no different than the other divisions. NDSU (North Dakota State) won the FCS championship at 14-1 and they had a bye in the 1st round.
the D2 champion went 14-1
D3 is 14 games

They pretty much play straight through with no bye weeks in the lower divisions, don't they? Also, there's no break between the end of the regular season and the playoffs, while some FBS teams have to sit around for a month or so before playing their bowl game. I suppose the top division could do this, too, but TV likes having a "season kickoff" weekend in late August and the Army-Navy game winding things up in early December.

Just wondering: In a 16- or 24-team playoff FBS, would the utterly bogus conference championship games still be played? Those exist for no other purpose but to make money, for the conferences, for television and for gamblers.

joebtsflk1 · Jan 11, 2018

In 2016, there were ten conferences in the FBS side of Division I plus five independent schools. A 16 team playoff system would allow for all of the conference champions ( so yes, the conference championship games would still be needed) plus six "wild card" slots.

Mr Tony · Jan 12, 2018

CTListener said:
They pretty much play straight through with no bye weeks in the lower divisions, don't they? Also, there's no break between the end of the regular season and the playoffs, while some FBS teams have to sit around for a month or so before playing their bowl game. I suppose the top division could do this, too, but TV likes having a "season kickoff" weekend in late August and the Army-Navy game winding things up in early December.

Looking at some schedules of local teams its kinda hit and miss if they get a bye or not. I looked at some local teams that play the various divisions and it was split down the middle as to teams that got a bye and those who didnt.
Unless you get a bye in the first round of the playoffs, yeah you play through.

umfan · Jan 16, 2018

Well, the CBP is locked in at four teams for the next several years. I don't see any real controversy from this season, so there is no real impetus to change. If you went to a 16 team playoff you'd be adding 1-2 games to schedules that already have too many games.

joebtsflk1 · Jan 16, 2018

umfan said:
All of those Divisions play far fewer regular season games. If Div 1 was willing to give up regular season games, I'd be for such a playoff construct, but it would destroy the Bowl Game system which does provide economic benefit to the communities that host them. For the life of me, I don't see why so many people feel the need to define the Div 1 champion by a playoff. The kids who get to the CFP final play 15 games. They are supposed to be students, in case anyone has forgotten that.

1. The DII champion this year, Texas A&M-Commerce finished their year at 14 -1. D-I champ Alabama, 13 - 1.
2. In my original post I suggested that the playoffs be incorporated into the existing bowl structure. The second and third tier bowls could rotate hosting a playoff game, just like the Rose, Orange, Sugar and Fiesta bowls. No need to get rid of the bowls, except to say that it's tough to justify teams in bowl games that have losing seasons unless they finished their season with an impressive string of wins.
3. You're right, they are supposed to be students. At D1, that fantasy expired long ago. They are indentured servants that have an opportunity to perhaps get an education. When these programs make such huge amounts of money for the universities, can't the athletes be paid minimum wage for the hours they practice, with additional pay for the time they play during games?

I continue to disagree. The College Football Playoff rarely invites teams out of the power five conferences. They don't want the Boise States of the world coming in and spoiling their cozy, intimate party.

umfan · Jan 17, 2018

IMO, instead of paying student athlete's, the NFL should start a developmental league rather than relying more or less exclusively on College Football for its talent.

UCF would've gotten a invite this year had it been undefeated and played tougher games. I, for one, believe that they wouldn't have been undefeated had their game against Georgia Tech not been cancelled.

A great season for UCF, but not a National Championship one.

You're for a bigger CFP, I'm not. We simply disagree. I respect your POV on this.

joebtsflk1 · Jan 17, 2018

I'll agree with you on the NFL developmental league. Whether D1 schools want anyone goring their golden goose, I don't know. But D1 football and basketball programs can't continue to eclipse their academic missions forever.

KeithE4 · Jan 17, 2018

joebtsflk1 said:
I'll agree with you on the NFL developmental league. Whether D1 schools want anyone goring their golden goose, I don't know. But D1 football and basketball programs can't continue to eclipse their academic missions forever.

Two words: NFL Europe. Three more: Out Of Business.

See also: United States Football League (which some guy named Trump was involved in), the United Football League (who?), and the just-about-dead Arena Football League. Minor league pro football just doesn't work.

CTListener · Jan 17, 2018

KeithE4 said:
Two words: NFL Europe. Three more: Out Of Business.

See also: United States Football League (which some guy named Trump was involved in), the United Football League (who?), and the just-about-dead Arena Football League. Minor league pro football just doesn't work.

The NFL has never really put its muscle into a minor league -- one that runs concurrently with the NFL, not summer leagues like NFL Europe and Arena Football -- because it is perfectly happy to have the colleges prepare its talent, and as long as one-and-dones aren't allowed at the college level, there really is no need for a minor league system the way the established systems in baseball and hockey are set up. (Hockey also has the elaborate junior hockey system feeding it and polishing young talent in addition to its professional minor leagues.)

For the longest time, the NBA did little to encourage or assist the half-assed Continental Basketball Association, but it became apparent that teams were drafting a lot of players who just weren't ready for the NBA, so effort WAS put into the D-League, and now it is quite successful. I watch games occasionally online, and the quality of play is excellent. I'd definitely support a D-League team should one come to Hartford or Springfield, Mass.

joebtsflk1 · Jan 17, 2018

KeithE4 said:
Two words: NFL Europe. Three more: Out Of Business.

See also: United States Football League (which some guy named Trump was involved in), the United Football League (who?), and the just-about-dead Arena Football League. Minor league pro football just doesn't work.

And why it won't can be spelled with four letters: NCAA. Especially the D1 schools.