People have been complaining about commercials for 100 years. The first one aired in 1922.
They need commercials to pay the bills. If they had another way to make money, they'd do it.
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WNCI had 21 minutes of commercials in the 11:00 am hour
- Thread starter william#1
- Start date
People have been complaining about commercials for 100 years. The first one aired in 1922.
They need commercials to pay the bills. If they had another way to make money, they'd do it.
Something to remember too. Their #1 station the market has a very heavy spot load too. It’s not just commercials.
Lee de Forest the man who made broadcast radio possible certainly was unhappy. He thought they had ruined his baby.
Nathan Stubblefield, the first guy to demonstrate broadcasting didn't approve also.
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The rest of the story. It's not just commercials. Now it makes sense.
Here's how this works; You make something and sell it. After you sell it, the new owners get to do what they want.
So radio sells spots to advertisers. That time is theirs. Nobody in radio loves commercials, but they pay the bills.
Radio is best when it's the right balance between programming and sales.
In the past, a great cluster would have an effective sales manager, a GM who nearly always came from a sales background, and a PD who would be the fierce advocate for the station's on-air sound. A great PD could collaborate with sales to create effective promotions, but would also fight against excesses like a 21-minute commercial break.
These days a medium market cluster PD at a conglomerate may be more like an operations manager for 6-8 stations whose job is to make sure things that are mostly parachuted in are running the way the mothership wants them to run. If the sales side want to drop 21 minutes of spots into a network or remotely voice-tracked show, there's not really an effective gatekeeper there to blow the whistle on it. The head office is sales-first and they'll do what they want without that push-and-pull between sales and programming that used to exist. So, you end up with sales running the whole show, probably not even there to hear the result.
It doesn't make for great radio when the ship is so lopsided.
In the past, a great cluster would have an effective sales manager, a GM who nearly always came from a sales background, and a PD who would be the fierce advocate for the station's on-air sound. A great PD could collaborate with sales to create effective promotions, but would also fight against excesses like a 21-minute commercial break.
These days a medium market cluster PD at a conglomerate may be more like an operations manager for 6-8 stations whose job is to make sure things that are mostly parachuted in are running the way the mothership wants them to run. If the sales side want to drop 21 minutes of spots into a network or remotely voice-tracked show, there's not really an effective gatekeeper there to blow the whistle on it. The head office is sales-first and they'll do what they want without that push-and-pull between sales and programming that used to exist. So, you end up with sales running the whole show, probably not even there to hear the result.
It doesn't make for great radio when the ship is so lopsided.
It was a hell of a lot easier to advocate for a station sound in the past. It's a lot harder now to get money from these advertisers who want the most audience for the least amount of money. Yiu have no idea how hard it is. When you actually sit in those meetings, and the boss looks at you and asks for better ideas, what would you say? If your job is on the line.
You need to have tough skin to do sales. Women find themselves sexually harassed by potential clients all the time. They might treat you worse than a dog. The money in sales is good for those who aren't easily offended.
It's difficult to find good salespeople. However there are some who are really good at it. And they were fun to have around.
It's difficult to find good salespeople. However there are some who are really good at it. And they were fun to have around.
There is something much worse than to many commercials. Not having enough. I'd post the dollars brought in by each salesperson on a bulletin board and have them compete with each other.
Ad agencies only buy 5 deep in the ratings.
Ad agencies only buy 5 deep in the ratings.
That what I do
Some of those guys have such contempt for the product they're selling I have to wonder why they don't just sell insurance instead.
Years ago I heard a frustrated PD rant that management would rather run a test tone between commercial breaks if they could get away with it. These days I feel like some of what passes for entertainment on the radio isn't much better than that.
@bturner1 im surprise no ones come along and said.. well maybe stations should raise their rates. no one has that i ca nsee.
I've seen it before in other discussions.. anyone who says that is clueless, and hasnt worked in current day radio.. you and i both know, 90 plus percent of the time, it wont work.
It just seems to me that we've lost the whole point of this thread. No one here is saying that commercials are not important. We all know that they are. The point is they are running 21 minutes in a row. Anybody still listening to that station after 21 minutes likes being tied up and whipped. Why would you torch your entire audience and then spend the rest of the day trying to build it from scratch? Maybe just maybe that accounts for them dropping to eighth in the market?
And enough with the "ratings are down because the music sucks". I pointed to several examples of CHRs that are doing quite well with the same music and there are many more.
And enough with the "ratings are down because the music sucks". I pointed to several examples of CHRs that are doing quite well with the same music and there are many more.
And I showed you that Z100 runs 21 minutes of commercials and they're a Top 5 station. How could that be??
Some people are making assumptions about audience behavior. Stations have a lot more information that the 6+ numbers.
You don't want to do that. Ever. You want to have sellers try to do better on their account list than prior months and years. At most stations, not every seller has as good a list, so you can not have them compete on gross sales. You can have them compete on "% over same month last year" or something similar, but the "prize" for that should never denigrate other sellers.
That is an unfortunately untrue and vague observations.
Agencies may buy 3 deep or 10 deep, depending on the budget and the desired number of Grips they want in each market. And they buy against much more specific demos than just the broad 25-54. More like "women 25-44" or "Men 35-54" and so on. They can even be as specific in some markets as "English dominant Hispanic Women 25-44".
WKRQ is number 3 in Cincinnati. They must be doing something right.
I see people on here making excuses for bad radio. 21 minutes of commercials. No kidding. No wonder young people are streaming their music on smartphones in many cities.
An FCC official told me radio is doing itself in.
If you believe advertisers are fine with their commercials being buried toward the middle or end of a 21 minute stop set, I have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale!
I strongly doubt this fact has been disclosed to the advertisers.
Few if any folks posting here are complaining about the concept of radio stations playing commercials. The complaints pertain to the excessively lengthy nature of some stations' stopsets.
That's correct. I may be from the old school. But no station back in the day would hit the legal ID at the top of the hour followed by 21 minutes of ads.
So someone opens a thread about the super long commercial break and here comes the usual haughty screen names trying to make the poster look like a dumb ass.
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Only one or two here are anywhere maar Columbus. Just grumpy old men from far away.