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Greg Hill WEEI
- Thread starter willjr
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The Sports Hub sticks to a firm schedule for commercial breaks for every show. One of the things that WEEI changed when The Sports Hub started to dent its ratings was to shorten its commercial breaks. It seems like both stations value short commercial breaks and don't have the worries you have.
They'll be in the building prepping for the new EEI show.
Incorrect. The Globe gets the monthly breakdowns from Nielsen. They always have. They used to publish monthly numbers for key demos(18-34, 25-54, 35+) in their media columns(sports and non-sports) over the years. In recent years, their sports page editor had chosen to only publish qtrly numbers for the two sports stations so they could provide a better picture of how the stations are doing over time vs the monthly trends.
You mean -- gasp! -- Radio Discussions' resident experts could actually be WRONG??? Do other non-broadcast entities also get detailed numbers handed them by Nielsen for publication to a general readership?
I can remember in the early D&C days they'd come back from the 9AM break at about 9:12.
Can't speak for other non-broadcast entities but in Globe's case they have access to the numbers. In addition, they have access to Nielsen's rep for clarification on how the numbers should be interpreted.(stream vs nonstream, incoporating out of market relays,etc.).
Maybe that's changed, because I recall "back in the day" having to sneak the numbers to The Globe.
In the PPM markets, the public release data consists of 6+ 6 AM to Midnight shares and cume. There is very limited (and qualified) tacit consent to publish the main demos (18-34 and 25-54) and daypart rankers but those do not come from Nielsen.
You have a misunderstanding of how the PPM has worked for the last decade in Boston. Monthly numbers are not "trends" in the PPM markets; they are books. Each of the 13 annual books, named (somewhat inaccurately) for the 12 months and the "Holiday" 4-week period, stands on its own and is not a rolling average of three months as the trends were (and still are [till next month] in the diary markets).
Nielsen does not produce a 3-month "quarterly" report. Anyone who publishes "quarterly" PPM numbers is simply taking three books (the monthly reports) and averaging them. There are software apps that can do this for you and create multi-book average reports. But Nielsen has no "quarterly" reports in PPM markets... just monthly books.
And Nielsen does not issue "quarterly" PPM reports to the media, and there are no "trends". There are 13 full, self contained, fully weighted and proportional books.
Obviously, any publication, whether print or electronic, that runs ratings data, is likely to have contacts that can provide the permitted rankers in dayparts and the principal standard demographics.
Remember, a lot of Arbitron policies changed with the introduction of the PPM and even more changed with Nielsen bought Arbitron.
As an example, public release data no longer contains information on stations that are not subscribed; in the distant past it did. And the confidential subscriber reports do not show unsubscribed stations that have less than a 0.1 rating (equivalent to about a 1.1 share in most markets) at all.
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No, nobody does unless they actually subscribe.
In the past, a wider variety of non-radio entities could subscribe beyond the natural ones of ad agencies and large advertisers. Years ago, when doing syndication in Miami, I bought the Miami book for less than $200 per year and I did not even have a syndication client in Miami... or even in the US.
With the PPM, things tightened up. When Nielsen took over, a new vision of how proprietary the data really should be took over.
That is coupled with the very high cost of PPM subscriptions in the PPM markets... initially as much as 60% higher than the diary service in those markets. The end result was fewer marginal stations subscribed to the service and a concern that those stations would obtain and use data through third parties, generally friends at ad agencies.
The major concern is that public release data can be used by non-subscribed stations to sell... copies or images of reports in the local newspaper being a source. So Nielsen wants to limit the available data, and that includes not listing non-subscribers in the public release data.
My bad. I thought you meant he wrote for a show, not for a paper.
What is an "out of market relay"?
The policy is quite simple: "the press" gets a list of 6+ share and cume for every subscribed station that "makes the book" in a market. "Station" includes a licensed AM, FM, translator, HD sub-channel (beyond HD-1) and stream.
So the list includes subscribed AM, FM, HD-2, HD-3 and streams. Each is labeled. There is no "interpretation" at all as what is sent is simply a ranker with the audio source and its share listed in best to worst order.
Simulcasts (AM and FM, FM and FM, AM and AM) are combined in a single number if the owner has so requested an the simulcast is total. HD and translators, AM and translators and FMs with translators are by law simulcasts and are listed under the "master" station. That means any numbers for an AM with a translator are listed for the AM and an HD with a translator are listed for the HD and so on.
Out of market stations that are not subscribed to the local market report are not listed.
And yet, if you follow the link to Finn's Twitter feed, he puts out program-specific, demo-specific numbers for the shows on Boston's two sports stations, not just beauty-pageant 6+ numbers. I assume this is the same data he's putting in the paper. So what's the deal? Is there a mole at one or both stations feeding him more detailed info than what a non-broaudcast entity ought to be able to receive?
I'm guessing that "out-of-market relay" may refer to the fact that one of the Boston sports talkers (WEEI, I think) is also heard in Hartford on an HD2 or HD3. I think I raised the question here a while back and got the reply that those Hartford listeners go down as listeners to the local station, not to WEEI, not that WEEI's local advertisers would have any interest in reaching Hartford ears anyway.
Likely so. Someone at a station or an agency is providing the demo rankers. Nielsen has not issued c&d notices for demo rankers as long as rank but not share are listed. They are within their rights to put a legal stop to that if they wish.
We see rather commonly, such as on AllAccess.Com, rankers of the top 18-34 and 25-54 stations and rankers on dayparts. So far, Nielsen has not questioned this but the data does not come from them.
You are correct. The PPM is a local market service, and listening is recorded for the Boston PPM by members of the Boston panel... that is, people living in the Boston MSA. If a listener in Providence listens to a Boston station, that listening is credited in the Providence book. Similarly, if a Boston panelist listens to an out of market station or is actually out of market on a trip, that listening is credited to the Boston book, not to the market the station is home to.
I didn't say the reports come with interpretation.I said the Globe receives the reports every qtr and has access to a Nielsen representative who on various occasions had provided them with insight as to why EEI or the Hub would claim victory in the same demo or daypart. When both stations were neck and neck in the ratings for a while, the spin of the results was more important than the numbers. "out of market" relays is the Providence signal which has listeners in the Boston market. EEI has always included Providence in their promotional material.
Again,the Globe has access to the numbers and are allowed to quote it for newswriting purposes. We can do this all day but I'm telling you what I know.
Again, there are no "quarterly" reports that the Globe could receive because Nielsen does not produce a quarterly report of any kind for the PPM markets.
Nielsen does not "interpret" the specific ratings for anyone, even clients. They provide data. They provide online and in-market training for clients. Clients can contact them for "issues" like samples, quotas, complaints about apparent problems. But in 50 years of dealing with them they have never given opinion about competitive situations.
And Nielsen does not give demo and daypart information to the press.
Were the Providence station to get any listening in the Boston MSA, it would appear as a separate listing for the RI station. Only 100% simulcast (ads and content 24/7) can be combined with the originating station. Nielsen does not list them as a simulcast, so the numbers would not be combined under "Total Line Reporting". WVEI does not appear in the Boston book, either (it does appear in New Bedford and New London, though).
Nielsen releases 6+ PPM data for share and cume for subscribed stations. It does not give demos and dayparts to "the press". Any additional data is coming from a subscriber, and in violation of the terms of the Nielsen contact. Since you are referring to a "quarterly" report... which has not existed for a decade in Boston... I am concluding that your knowledge is similarly out of date.
Ah, the little network.
None of the network stations show in the Boston book, and they are not combined with WEEI-FM as they are not a "pure" simulcast and sell local inventory.
I believe the Providence station, WVEI-FM, has shown up at times in the past.
I don't see anything since Spring of 2013.
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