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Split Channel Broadcasting

J

jdawg03

Inactive
Inactive User
OK guys, I need some help on this one:

I broadcast football games online. Recently Ive teamed up with a local radio station and they are going to take my game feeds and put them on their station.

Here's the question: How would I go about putting two games on one station. I know it can be done, as Ive heard of another station doing this. Basically, you have game A on the left speaker and game B on the right. Listeners would have to use their balance and move to either side to listen to the game they would want to hear

How is this done? I know it has something with stereo. Is there something I can do on my end. I thought about maybe combining both games together on a separate stream and then feeding it to the station. But I haven't figured out how to make it work. Maybe it would be better for them to do it at the station.

Help! thanks!
 
jdawg03 said:
OK guys, I need some help on this one:

I broadcast football games online. Recently Ive teamed up with a local radio station and they are going to take my game feeds and put them on their station.

Here's the question: How would I go about putting two games on one station. I know it can be done, as Ive heard of another station doing this. Basically, you have game A on the left speaker and game B on the right. Listeners would have to use their balance and move to either side to listen to the game they would want to hear

How is this done? I know it has something with stereo. Is there something I can do on my end. I thought about maybe combining both games together on a separate stream and then feeding it to the station. But I haven't figured out how to make it work. Maybe it would be better for them to do it at the station.

Help! thanks!
Click to expand...

How about, no. The FCC frowns on those shenanigans since it wouldn't be mono compatible. Anyone with a mono radio or a stereo car radio with a blend circuit activated would hear an audio mess.
 
jdawg03 said:
I broadcast football games online. Recently Ive teamed up with a local radio station and they are going to take my game feeds and put them on their station.

Here's the question: How would I go about putting two games on one station. I know it can be done, as Ive heard of another station doing this. Basically, you have game A on the left speaker and game B on the right. Listeners would have to use their balance and move to either side to listen to the game they would want to hear
Click to expand...

I think the question requires some clarification. Are you talking about placing audio for two different games on your webstream or is the radio station talking about running two games on their station facility?

Streaming the audio with separate left and right programming is not governed by the FCC, although it may lead some technically challenged users to the nut house as many computer speakers lack balance controls and they would have to get acquainted with the balance control in the computer's OS.

As far as the station goes, and I'm assuming you're speaking FM, about the only "real" option for the station would be to stick one game on their HD2 channel if they have one.
 
jdawg03 said:
so is it actually illegal? Obviously dont want to do it if thats the case.
Click to expand...

I'm an engineer, not a lawyer, but I'm not aware of any FCC regulation that ever required the left and right channel audio be related.

It will however drive your audience crazy. I'd bet a significant majority of listeners don't know where their balance control is -- these days there usually isn't a separate knob for it -- and many cheaper radios don't even have a control.
 
I was under the impression it was a mono compatibility issue. In the past I know Chief Engineers have nixed the idea of split channel ball games for that reason. On a related note, the FCC have flagged stations for a dual city ID when they put the COL out of phase next to the big city in phase because of mono compatibility.
 
radiorob2.0 said:
I was under the impression it was a mono compatibility issue. In the past I know Chief Engineers have nixed the idea of split channel ball games for that reason. On a related note, the FCC have flagged stations for a dual city ID when they put the COL out of phase next to the big city in phase because of mono compatibility.
Click to expand...

Oh, it's definitely not mono-compatible! In radio, as in life in general, there are a lot of things you can do that are dumb but not illegal...

The FCC gets involved when something they *require* to be broadcast (like the legal ID, or EAS data) is illegible.
 
Based on the staffing level at the FCC, it is not likely that you would ever have a problem with them. You will, however, have a huge problem with listeners, most of whom listen on a mono receiver. Plus, even on stereo receivers with the ability to pan left or right, you will hve crosstalk which in some cases might make the game difficult to hear.

Or, you could buy a bunch of subcarrier receivers and offer them at cost ($15-20) to listeners, available through local sponsors, or the sponsors could promote them FREE with certain purchases. The ones I've played with have a switch on the front, to select from main channel to 2 subcarriers. Technically, the station could have 3 games going on at once, with the most popular game on the main, then the other(s). Of course the listeners end up with a nice little portable receiver for regular listening as well.
 
Bill Wolfenbarger said:
Based on the staffing level at the FCC, it is not likely that you would ever have a problem with them. You will, however, have a huge problem with listeners, most of whom listen on a mono receiver. Plus, even on stereo receivers with the ability to pan left or right, you will hve crosstalk which in some cases might make the game difficult to hear.

Or, you could buy a bunch of subcarrier receivers and offer them at cost ($15-20) to listeners, available through local sponsors, or the sponsors could promote them FREE with certain purchases. The ones I've played with have a switch on the front, to select from main channel to 2 subcarriers. Technically, the station could have 3 games going on at once, with the most popular game on the main, then the other(s). Of course the listeners end up with a nice little portable receiver for regular listening as well.
Click to expand...

Wow thats an interesting alternative. Could you recommend somewhere to buy those receivers or radios? Also, what is needed on the radio station's end to transmit the signal out? Or should they already have that capability? Sorry, I'm a web guy, not a radio guy. Thanks for the idea!
 
SCA receivers are on ebay and call the seller to get the bulk price.

There have been several articles on split broadcasting. In Evansville a station broadcast one game left, another right. It was one of those things that drove listeners away in droves and you had to train them how to do what they were going to ahev to do. Even though they already had the equipment most didn't know left from right or mono or cb.

Two operators running two studios sent to a patch panel (hey remember those?) that was patched at a certain time.

Big write up in radio world some time back on another station that did this.

Those listeners in the blend area would get BOTH games at the same price. Given the mentality of listeners (which I place a high value in depsite their mentality) you would expect only those who had their wives write down the instructions and had their wives set the radio up (intentionally to the wrong channel) to listen.

HD is one answer but what station that values local games has the money to pay 37k for HD rights and the other 150k for an exciter?

Ask james bradshaw [email protected] for an actual answer.

His first question might be : why? Tape delay is another answer. Record the game with less revenue and replay it after the big game. Another try? On Am we would replay last nights game the next day. Friday night saturday morning. You don't have to train folks how to use their mono radio in discrete left or right either.
 
The best inexpensive radio I came across was less than $20 and from www.radiosca.com. It appears, however, that they may not be still in business , since their website is not fully functional anymore.

I have one of these little radios in my possession, and it sounds good, works well, is compact.

To broadcast SCA, you need an SCA generator. They are inexpensive on eBay, used. Typically use 67kHz, also use 92 kHz if requiring two subcarriers. Subcarriers are also still used by some FM broadcasters to get data back from the transmitter to the studio.
 
This option is few is far between in this day and age, but if your cable company still utilizes a time and temperature/information channel see if you can lease the audio. I worked for a station that owned the cable company and would feature one high school game on the AM and another option on the time/temperature channel.
 
How about picking the bigger game and broadcasting it live, etc. Then, in breaks of action of that game, go to the other game with live updates. I think you'd be much happier with the results. Let's face it. What the audience really wants in a game is scoreing and some highlights every so often. If you have the most interesting game in true play-by-play but keep the audience up to date on the other game concurrently in progress, you win.
 
Another bad thing about this idea is the fact that most FM signals only have about 25-30 dB of seperation between the Left and Right channels. (Unless the station is lucky enough to have one of the new expensive digital audio processors which can do theoritically 50 dB or so, but most stations don't and most stations haven't been tuned up or had an audio proof in decades! ) Seperation is especially bad on the high frequencies.

So, even if you're listening to one game, which by the way will only come out of One Channel, you will still hear the other games audio spitting and chirping in the background which would be very irritating. Pity the poor soul listening on a clock radio, the product would be unusable.
 
I'd skip the left with one right with the other on the main channel because anything that degrades seperation is going to put the unwanted station in the background. Turn a source of talk up on your board to zero level. Then put another one on with the fader set at -30 or so, and listen. You can run the unwanted up and down to see what degree of seperation is necessary before it becomes really obnoxious over time. Tape delay is a way better solution, as is a subcarrier.
 
Oh - it will be mono compatible. A mono receiver will ion fact get the information on both channels, which is the intent of mono compatibility.
 
My old high school station used to do a dual broadcast of 2 games at the same time by having 2 different PBP teams, one at each game, then the board op in the studio switched between them depending on the action.
 
I do work for a station who does this to this very day. They straddle two local markets, so they carry both games. One on the left, one on the right. I rigged up a switch to give him his Audition bus on the left, Program bus on the right. Two telephones connected to his board. One in Audition, one in Program. TaDa! He announced every 10 mins or so to balance Left or Right for either team. Local Folk Love It!
 
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