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Bye Bye KMLE

C

CAVEMANager

Guest
As a broadcaster I've always enjoyed tuning in the more powerful Phoenix stations just to see what they're up to. In Tucson KMLE has just been obliterated by a new translator on 107.9. It programs Mexican Jesus, relaying KNOG in Nogales. Until a couple years ago I enjoyed tuning in KSLX until it got severely damaged by a translator for an AM in Green Valley. Seems obvious that the FCC has been taken over by politically appointed commissioners who know nothing about sound engineering. They are hell bent on destruction of FM radio as we know it. Some of this idiocy is done in the name of saving AM radio. It's too bad that FM broadcasters have no choice except to sit back and watch our coverage get gobbled up.
 
Phoenix stations don't target Tucson, and vice versa. There's no need whatsoever for a Phoenix station to be audible anywhere south of Casa Grande.
 
CAVEMANager said:
As a broadcaster I've always enjoyed tuning in the more powerful Phoenix stations just to see what they're up to. In Tucson KMLE has just been obliterated by a new translator on 107.9. It programs Mexican Jesus, relaying KNOG in Nogales. Until a couple years ago I enjoyed tuning in KSLX until it got severely damaged by a translator for an AM in Green Valley. Seems obvious that the FCC has been taken over by politically appointed commissioners who know nothing about sound engineering. They are hell bent on destruction of FM radio as we know it. Some of this idiocy is done in the name of saving AM radio. It's too bad that FM broadcasters have no choice except to sit back and watch our coverage get gobbled up.
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The protected contour of KMLE extends to just about Eloy on the Phoenix to Tucson route. Beyond that, the station was neither licensed to serve listeners nor guaranteed that there would not be other stations in communities outside the protected contour that would interfere with it beyond the "guaranteed" coverage area.

What the heck is "Mexican Jesus"? Do you simply mean "religious programming in Spanish"?
 
DavidEduardo said:


The protected contour of KMLE extends to just about Eloy on the Phoenix to Tucson route. Beyond that, the station was neither licensed to serve listeners nor guaranteed that there would not be other stations in communities outside the protected contour that would interfere with it beyond the "guaranteed" coverage area.
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The owner of KRDE in Globe has been successful at preventing KSUN from building out a translator from their AM tower site on 94.1, even though that sits right out of their 60 dBu contour. Right now, KSUN still has a permit to build the translator on 106.3, which would interfere with KOMR, a station that has a bigger audience in that area than KRDE does in the area. KRDE needs to understand that they're not licensed to serve Phoenix, and they'll never be a player in the market, so protecting their signal for that one listener in Laveen is not worth the effort.
 
EricStein said:
The owner of KRDE in Globe has been successful at preventing KSUN from building out a translator from their AM tower site on 94.1, even though that sits right out of their 60 dBu contour. Right now, KSUN still has a permit to build the translator on 106.3, which would interfere with KOMR, a station that has a bigger audience in that area than KRDE does in the area. KRDE needs to understand that they're not licensed to serve Phoenix, and they'll never be a player in the market, so protecting their signal for that one listener in Laveen is not worth the effort.
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The most significant precedent for this is the Hazard, KY, stations that caused listeners in the vicinity of Lexington to write objections to the station to be presented before the FCC in regards to interference to WSGS far outside its protected contour. The FCC found for the Hazard station.

The issue in Tucson is whether a) KMLE cares and b) whether a number of KMLE listeners in the market write to the FCC (or to the station for forwarding to the FCC).
 
DavidEduardo said:


What the heck is "Mexican Jesus"? Do you simply mean "religious programming in Spanish"?
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Well, that was from CAVEMAN, so consider the source!

Fact of the matter is the FCC has so opened the floodgates to translators and LPFMs that the FM dial is just as junked up (or more) than the AM dial. It's hard for Los Buckeye Boyz to wrap our fezzes around the schizo frequency 96~One...two stations overlapping each other in central Phoenix. YIKES!
 
DavidEduardo said:


The most significant precedent for this is the Hazard, KY, stations that caused listeners in the vicinity of Lexington to write objections to the station to be presented before the FCC in regards to interference to WSGS far outside its protected contour. The FCC found for the Hazard station.

The issue in Tucson is whether a) KMLE cares and b) whether a number of KMLE listeners in the market write to the FCC (or to the station for forwarding to the FCC).
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I'm still not convinced that KRDE has the audience size they claim they have west of Apache Junction. They don't even do a great job at superserving Southern Gila County like their class-A competitor at 101.9 does.
 
There's a 107.9 in Nogales (KCKO) as well that came on in 2012. It's not an AM translator - it's a Spanish romantic format, co-owned with a newspaper and TV station in Nogales, Sonora.

The ownership structure is that Jaime Juaristi Santos (a Mexican citizen) owns 18% of JJS Media, which holds the KCKO license, and he holds the concession for the Mexican-side local TV station.

The 93.7, 94.9 and 96.1 in Tucson used to be really listenable in Chandler, but new locals blew them away. The 94.9 is particularly wasteful, at least where I am — where is it exactly that KOAI gets shaded or fades out?
 
We've seen some interesting arguments for allowing new translators and LPFMs to destroy existing service. One point is that the owners of the dominant signals don't care about distant listeners Another argument is that the new low powered stations are outside the protected contours of the dominant station. Both points strike me as unimportant. The listening public are the people who should count the most. The FCCs predicted contours are often wildly inaccurate, especially in mountainous areas. When a station has had coverage for years on end and listeners have been able to hear the station those listeners should be allowed to continue to enjoy the station's programming. It's also important to realize that when a low powered stations is dropped in, a vast zone of interference develops where neither the high powered station nor the low powered station can be heard. All you get in this zone is worthless noise. Last night I headed east of Tucson along I-10. I'd pick up the religious translator and later hear KMLE for a minute. Then the translator and so forth. 40 miles of worthless junk that used to be music.

As for the translator's programming, very likely its mission is to convert Catholic Mexicans into fundamentalist Protestant Mexicans. This organization got the channel only because they got to the FCC first. I don't care what religion the Mexicans are.
 
CAVEMANager said:
The listening public are the people who should count the most. The FCCs predicted contours are often wildly inaccurate, especially in mountainous areas.
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Protection on FM is based on mileage separations according to class of station, not on predicted contours. It does not matter if there are mountains or valleys, or rivers or lakes... stations are protected as members of a class.

When a station has had coverage for years on end and listeners have been able to hear the station those listeners should be allowed to continue to enjoy the station's programming.
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I looked at the last decade of ratings for the South Mountain Phoenix FMs, and while about half of them occasionally show in the Prescott/Flag book, none has shown in the Tucson book.

So the point about listening in the Tucson metro is moot. It's better, at least in the mind of the FCC, to have local signals that offer diverse programming options than virtual DX listening to waaaaaaay out of market signals.

It's also important to realize that when a low powered stations is dropped in, a vast zone of interference develops where neither the high powered station nor the low powered station can be heard. All you get in this zone is worthless noise.
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The interference caused by a translator is within the predicted contours (which in the case of FM are essentially a circle drawn on a theoretical flat map based on class, power, HAAT, etc.) of that translator and outside the protected contours of the other station(s).

Last night I headed east of Tucson along I-10. I'd pick up the religious translator and later hear KMLE for a minute. Then the translator and so forth. 40 miles of worthless junk that used to be music.
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And KMLE is not supposed to be protected up until near Casa Grande. So there is no loss of protected coverage. And were there, it is up to the affected station to file an objection or lose it.

As for the translator's programming, very likely its mission is to convert Catholic Mexicans into fundamentalist Protestant Mexicans.
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You know this how? It's mission could just as well be to serve its own congregation throughout the week.

Religious stations are not of an inferior class. You may dislike them, or dislike stations in Spanish or both, but the fact is that diverse program formats are one of the FCC's objectives.
 
If you're unhappy with interference from a translator, notify the station. If it feels your listening is worth its time, it can pursue a complaint with the FCC. As one of the other posters mentions, a translator may not interfere with any full power station regardless of signal contours and distance from transmitters (though I understand there's a petition before the FCC to change that). However, it's up to the station that receives an interference complaint whether or not to escalate it to the FCC.

Of course, if the station interfering is a full class FM (as another poster indicates is possible), there's not much you can do.
 
Kent said:
If you're unhappy with interference from a translator, notify the station. If it feels your listening is worth its time, it can pursue a complaint with the FCC. As one of the other posters mentions, a translator may not interfere with any full power station regardless of signal contours and distance from transmitters (though I understand there's a petition before the FCC to change that). However, it's up to the station that receives an interference complaint whether or not to escalate it to the FCC.

Of course, if the station interfering is a full class FM (as another poster indicates is possible), there's not much you can do.
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Now what if the translator interfering with the full power signal happens to be owned by the same people? Seems like a stupid situation, but that's exactly what is happening here in the East Valley with 97.3 FM. Right now, you got the pointless Hot 97.5 / 103.9 FM translator, K247CF-FM, licensed to Payson, AZ (which it is no longer serving, it broadcasts from the Usery Mountain Tower near the 99.1 KFXY-LPFM transmitter) interfering with KIKO-FM, Claypool, AZ (although on-air they sometimes ID the COL as Apache Junction), which is a full-time, C2 station that tries to market itself to the East Valley (specifically Mesa and Apache Junction). When both the translator and KIKO-FM are broadcasting at the same time, you can't listen to either one of them as each one overpowers the other. Now from what I understand, they are both owned by the same people so why would they interfere with their own signal? Makes no sense at all.

FYI, there is an application in with the FCC to have K247CF-FM moved from Usery Mountain to South Mountain to better serve Phoenix. My question is simple, with already good signal coverage with 97.5 in Phoenix and the West Valley and with 103.9 serving the East Valley, why is Hot 97.5 / 103.9 pushing the 97.3 translator?? https://fccdata.org/?appid=1753698&facid=144136

In this situation, would you file a complaint with KIKO-FM about a translator they own themselves? How stupid is that! I must be the only person that likes to listen to KIKO-FM, but their selection of oldies is sometimes better than Oldies 92.7 with more 50's and 60's hits.
 
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asugeorge1 said:
Now what if the translator interfering with the full power signal happens to be owned by the same people? Seems like a stupid situation, but that's exactly what is happening here in the East Valley with 97.3 FM. Right now, you got the pointless Hot 97.5 / 103.9 FM translator, K247CF-FM, licensed to Payson, AZ (which it is no longer serving, it broadcasts from the Usery Mountain Tower near the 99.1 KFXY-LPFM transmitter) interfering with KIKO-FM, Claypool, AZ (although on-air they sometimes ID the COL as Apache Junction), which is a full-time, C2 station that tries to market itself to the East Valley (specifically Mesa and Apache Junction). When both the translator and KIKO-FM are broadcasting at the same time, you can't listen to either one of them as each one overpowers the other. Now from what I understand, they are both owned by the same people so why would they interfere with their own signal? Makes no sense at all.
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It's John Low. He has no clue what he's doing with his stations.
 
asugeorge1 said:
Now what if the translator interfering with the full power signal happens to be owned by the same people?
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You send a complaint to the full power station, and it decides whether to file an interference complaint with the FCC. If the translator and full-power station are owned by the same people, they're obviously not going to go to pursue the matter with the FCC. Hopefully, they will have an engineer look at the situation and try to resolve it, but there's no guarantee. As you mentioned, they're probably not all that concerned with your listening to KIKO-FM, and you're probably out of luck.
 
DrAkbar said:
Well, that was from CAVEMAN, so consider the source!

Fact of the matter is the FCC has so opened the floodgates to translators and LPFMs that the FM dial is just as junked up (or more) than the AM dial. It's hard for Los Buckeye Boyz to wrap our fezzes around the schizo frequency 96~One...two stations overlapping each other in central Phoenix. YIKES!
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Not to mention messing up KSWG in certain parts of the city.
 
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