How does Audio Vault work compared to an older (and perhaps more simple) program

I'm used to working with a board where only one channel is dedicated to the music software, and you can adjust the output volume for different purposes, and start the next cart simply by pressing the 'start' button on the board for putting the software into manual and automatic mode (translates to the "on" button). I am curious, however, of how a program like Audio Vault differs. From what i've seen, it looks like Audio Vault takes three or more channels on the board, and requires that all 3+ faders are left up.

Is it still possible to start carts by pressing a "start" button on the board, or are you forced to click something on the software?

How do you know which channel the audio is playing out of (so that you can turn down the fader to fit in a break)?

What is the purpose of many different channels for Audio Vault?

Thanks in advance. As you can probably tell, I am newer to the business.

AV like many programs can be configured in different ways, it can be setup just as you describe with a single fader and outboard buttons. The reason to set it up on multiple channels has to do with controlling the mix of elements. IE: Lower a fader to talk over a music bed, then play a song on the fallowing fader at full volume. AV can be run in "auto" or "live" modes, one will run the play list on its own, the other requires interaction to run each element. You can assign contact closure's to do may things in the software, they are some times connected to the on/off buttons of the console or other buttons that have been mounted in the studio. As to what fader the audio will come up on, you would assign a name to each deck in the software and wire the audio output accordingly.

See the image below. You'll notice each deck start button has a number in it, corresponding to fader 1, 2 or 3 on the board. There is an additional fader dedicated to the QuickStart buttons/Preview on my board.
Click the picture to enlarge.

At the top is the Start Next button, which does just what it says. It can also be remoted through a contact closure from the board. Our jocks seem to prefer using the mouse to click the button, rather than the ON button on the board. It will simply start the next event and fade out the currently playing one. If a deck is started from its own start button, that deck will play, but the auto sequence may or may not be turned on. That's the operator's choice.

This is just the deck portion of the screen. The log is in an area to the right of the decks. Other items (commercial inventory, music, jingles, etc., or QuickStarts) may be displayed on either the right or left side.

Thank you both for the info! I really like how all music beds can be loaded onto the system to help make things easier on the jocks. Where I work, we use a separate computer (and system) to air all of the material that simply will not work with the software (music beds, clips, etc). It seems to me like it would be a lot easier to have all of the material on the same system.

It sounds Audio Vault takes a little getting used to. Is it pretty "user friendly" compared to older automation programs? Again, the system I grew into was rather rudimentary (we run an earlier version of Prestine).

Here are some full screen shots:


The first one is the "usual" screen. The second one may be used quite a bit. Not only can the audio be fired by pressing the button, it can also be dragged and dropped into one of the decks, pushing elements below the insert point down. The third screen shows one of the inventory tabs. At the top is a search box to filter down to the desired audio. Columns can be sorted by the usual Windows click on the column header. In my system, clicking on the search box brings up an on-screen keyboard that can be "typed" on using the mouse. Optionally, the whole system lends itself well to touch-screen operaton. Also, the larger the monitor, the better.

You can PM me and we can talk, if you want.

Bill_981 said:

Here are some full screen shots:
View attachment 534View attachment 535View attachment 536

The first one is the "usual" screen. The second one may be used quite a bit. Not only can the audio be fired by pressing the button, it can also be dragged and dropped into one of the decks, pushing elements below the insert point down. The third screen shows one of the inventory tabs. At the top is a search box to filter down to the desired audio. Columns can be sorted by the usual Windows click on the column header. In my system, clicking on the search box brings up an on-screen keyboard that can be "typed" on using the mouse. Optionally, the whole system lends itself well to touch-screen operaton. Also, the larger the monitor, the better.

You can PM me and we can talk, if you want.

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Thank you Bill for the clarification. The right half of the first picture looks much like the Pristine system that we use (all of the music and spots loaded into one big list). Just to further clarify, the spots and music tracks will pop up on the main screen if left in auto, and they all are mapped to different channels like the music tracks?

I really do like the looks of this system though. While I've grown accustom to the program I use, it really doesn't work nearly this well.

That's correct. The "log" is on the left side, and it is used to automatically load the "decks" in order. I actually have 12 decks, and if one were to scroll down on the deck side, they can all be seen. The yellow squares in the log indicate cuts that have been loaded. As the top one finishes, the green square changes to an X to indicate it has been played, and the next cut will load and get a yellow square. You'll see the numbers in the "start" buttons. They just go 1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3 etc. Spots, other elements and music all use the same three channels.

I mentioned I have a fourth channel for the QuickStarts and it is also used for the preview function, whether from a deck, the log, or an inventory list. Preview plays the first few and last few seconds. The actual length is determined in an ini file, and is global. Drag and drop, as well as insert by name are available.

fordranger797 said:

Where I work, we use a separate computer (and system) to air all of the material that simply will not work with the software (music beds, clips, etc). It seems to me like it would be a lot easier to have all of the material on the same system.

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It's not a matter of it "won't work". Pristine was set up to only use the playlist sequencer, which runs in either MANUAL or AUTO. No Live Assist. The jock has to remember to switch to MANUAL before a break or else it will blow right into the spots - IMO not a very good setup!

There is functionality available in CDS32 for playing those bits but it's not being used. In a way it's better to NOT have everything on one system so if the automation goes down, the other computer serves as a backup.

fordranger797 said:

It sounds Audio Vault takes a little getting used to. Is it pretty "user friendly" compared to older automation programs? Again, the system I grew into was rather rudimentary (we run an earlier version of Prestine).

Click to expand...

Any new automation system takes a little getting used to, especially if it was installed without taking into account the way jocks actually need to use it. I've seen that happen time and again.

Rob Piotrowski said:

It's not a matter of it "won't work". Pristine was set up to only use the playlist sequencer, which runs in either MANUAL or AUTO. No Live Assist. The jock has to remember to switch to MANUAL before a break or else it will blow right into the spots - IMO not a very good setup!

There is functionality available in CDS32 for playing those bits but it's not being used. In a way it's better to NOT have everything on one system so if the automation goes down, the other computer serves as a backup.



Any new automation system takes a little getting used to, especially if it was installed without taking into account the way jocks actually need to use it. I've seen that happen time and again.

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Okay, that is interesting. I was under the impression that "Auto Segue" on Audio Vault pretty much was the exact same function as "Auto" mode in Prestine. When auto segue is off on Audio Vault, you do indeed have to either hit play (on the screen) or the start buttons on the channels, right?

Could you perhaps explain "live assist" and how its intended to work on a modern system?

I've had problems in the past while trying to throw Prestine back into manual mode at the end of a music set, though. It was more due to a lack of experience, but getting Prestine to restart after hitting the "stop" button in the place you want it to can be tricky.

Bill_981 said:

That's correct. The "log" is on the left side, and it is used to automatically load the "decks" in order. I actually have 12 decks, and if one were to scroll down on the deck side, they can all be seen.

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Okay, I like the sound of that. I personally like to see an overview of the hour so I know exactly how much time I have to fit in the final stopset before I end up getting too close to the legal ID. Prestine always throws in the legal ID right after the top of the hour changes, but I've heard that Audio Vault lets you do it a little early.

"Live Assist" is essentially automation that you control. The computer cues up the cuts and you hit a button (or even better, a switch on a console) and the computer plays the cut. When you're ready to segue to the next cut, hit the same button. The computer won't play until you tell it to. The console switch on your station's Pristine system simply toggles operation mode between Auto and Manual.

Pristine (and other automation systems) can drop cuts after the TOH to stay on time. More sophisticated systems (like NexGen) can adjust the pitch on the fly if backtiming to the TOH is required.

Rob Piotrowski said:

"Live Assist" is essentially automation that you control. The computer cues up the cuts and you hit a button (or even better, a switch on a console) and the computer plays the cut. When you're ready to segue to the next cut, hit the same button.

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Okay, that sounds like it works really well! I assume you would leave it in auto segue if you are trying to play a batch of songs with sweepers in between though, yes? You only need live assist when you actually plan to interact? I only bring that up because I know the trip cues can sometimes be a little off and it might be handy to be able to use live assist to make the show sound tighter.

I can only imagine what it was like back in the day where cart tapes had to be fired off manually. Hitting a button for a different music bank must be a cakewalk compared to that.

Rob Piotrowski said:

Pristine (and other automation systems) can drop cuts after the TOH to stay on time. More sophisticated systems (like NexGen) can adjust the pitch on the fly if backtiming to the TOH is required.

Click to expand...

I've been told that the FCC requires the Legal ID to air within the 10 minute window of :55 - :05. I suppose for that reason it's good to have software that can throw in the ID before a long song pops up at :59:59...

I've never had any issues with Pristine failing at the top of the hour, but I've heard that its possible for the program to get stuck at midnight when trying to load up the next log. I think I had a mini heart attack the first time I saw it flip to the next log, though.

One last question guys:

Does anyone know if you can drag and drop files from voxpro into Audio Vault, or are they separate interfaces that can't be combined?

One of the buttons on the deck screen is LIVE mode. We've hidden it, because the jocks are so used to the machine loading the decks. If we were to use live mode, then it would be exactly like the "old days" where one would have to load the carts into the machines or cue up the vinyl on the turntables. Of course, each deck would be started manually.

You'll notice a "&" icon in each deck. Clicking it would tell it to not automatically start that deck. The operator would hit the START NEXT button, which would start the system AND turn on AUTO SEGUE. Works like a semi-live mode. The playout would stop at the end of the cut and it would wait for a human input to continue. I think I mentioned that any audio in the inventory can be added to the playlist with a drag and drop.

In our log, we have a command at xx:58:00 to cause it to dump everything between the currently playing event and the TOH ID (which is the first thing in our hours), and then make the ID the next to play.

If you have pre-planned places where you want the automation to stop without human intervention, then you can put a STOP command in your playlist. It's the same effect as clicking on the "&" in the deck you want to not auto start.

Voice tracking is pretty easy, too. Depending on your installation, it can be done in the main studio, or in one of the production rooms, with the voice tracks being immediately available on-air. Again, you can put the talk locations in your music log, or add the VT on the fly. As with most systems, you can adjust the IN and OUT points for a smooth flow and talk up to the post.

If VoxPro and AudioVault are on the same network, then yes. You must first export from VP, but that can be to a location in the Vault. MP3 would probably be the best bet for that. Or you can use the built in editor in AV.

AV uses AVScheduler to merge the music and traffic logs and output a file that AVAir can read. There's no "flipping" the log at midnight, as logs are loaded when they are made available to AV. For example, this weekend, on Friday afternoon, we could actually see the Saturday, Sunday, Monday and Tuesday logs in the log gadget on the screen. That way, the first event in the next day is just the next event. If for some reason your 11p hour is short, you're not sitting there waiting for the next log to load, it just continues playing.

AV can backtime, if necessary. If you're ever in Orlando, let me know and I'll give you a tour.

Bill_981 said:

If you're ever in Orlando, let me know and I'll give you a tour.

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I'll have to keep that offer in mind, Bill. And if you ever find yourself in the state of Washington and feel like re-visiting an "old school" studio, I'll gladly give you a tour!

fordranger797 said:

I assume you would leave it in auto segue if you are trying to play a batch of songs with sweepers in between though, yes? You only need live assist when you actually plan to interact? I only bring that up because I know the trip cues can sometimes be a little off and it might be handy to be able to use live assist to make the show sound tighter.

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Exactly. I've set up several different automation systems to do just that. In fact, they switch automatically from automation to LA at the end of music and/or spot blocks. Again, one button easy - so the jocks can concentrate on their shows.

Rob Piotrowski said:

Exactly. I've set up several different automation systems to do just that. In fact, they switch automatically from automation to LA at the end of music and/or spot blocks. Again, one button easy - so the jocks can concentrate on their shows.

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It sounds like the system is pretty versatile. The problem that I have with Prestine is that it feels like I really don't have much control during a music set. I like to talk over the introduction of songs whenever I'm on, and I've found that you're better off just leaving the playlist in full auto mode and just throwing in your commentary rather than trying use manual mode. It would be nice to have a little control over when the next track starts rather than beginning a break over a fade-out and not being sure when it might trip.

Yep. Turn off the "&" and the cut ahead of it will play and end. When you're ready to start up again, just hit START NEXT. You can even use your music scheduler to pre-program stop points, if desired. Our morning show is sat delivered, as that is automated. The show triggers drops that we have had them do custom for us, so you'll hear their talent talking over the intro of their next song, but with a localized message. We also have traffic reports that are automatically ingested into the system, and play over the bed that's on the traffic intro, then go back to the network. If you're up between 3a & 7a PT, M-F, listen to http://2073.live.streamtheworld.com/WHKQFM_SC

Bill_981 said:

Yep. Turn off the "&" and the cut ahead of it will play and end. When you're ready to start up again, just hit START NEXT. You can even use your music scheduler to pre-program stop points, if desired. Our morning show is sat delivered, as that is automated. The show triggers drops that we have had them do custom for us, so you'll hear their talent talking over the intro of their next song, but with a localized message. We also have traffic reports that are automatically ingested into the system, and play over the bed that's on the traffic intro, then go back to the network. If you're up between 3a & 7a PT, M-F, listen to http://2073.live.streamtheworld.com/WHKQFM_SC

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Can the operator activate the "&" function via board, or can the remote only be used when you are looking to use "start next" function to launch into the next track?

It's going to be one of those things that I have to play around with to get the hang of it. Thank you for giving me at least a general idea of how to operate this thing, as it will surely be needed one of these days (and perhaps I'll be able to get through my first day of a new gig without leaving dead air ).
I will certainly check the morning program on your station sometime soon. I'd love to hear how it all comes together.