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dying AM radio

TheBigA said:
To all those unemployed talk hosts looking for work: Do something! Write a book, get yourself on TV, do a podcast, start a website, do something that shows what you do, and position yourself in today's media environment. The phone isn't going to ring just because of some new regulation. You need to be on the employer's radar. That's as much the case now as it ever was.
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That would require creativity and hard work. It's much easier to complain on message boards and try to get existing hosts fired.

And Dr. Drew started in radio. Loveline was around way before his TV stuff. KABC brought him in because he's a brand name and he'll probably do a good show.
 
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Goat Rodeo Cowboy said:


I don't know if I am just plain stupid this morning.... just plain lazy.... or a common combination of both.

You are taking something for granted. You assume we all know what EAS, PEP, CAP and Wx mean.

Let me borrow a phrase Rush used a lot in the early days: Maybe I'm from Loma Linda so you'll have to 'splain it to me.
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I'm still scratching my head about the "11/9/11" reference -- I think he is trying to refer to the horrendous events of September 11, 2001 but I can't really be sure -- but I'll be happy to provide the glossary he didn't:

EAS - Emergency Alert System, the present incarnation of what started as Conelrad and was later EBS (Emergency Broadcast System)/EANS (Emergency Alert Notification System).

PEP - Primary Entry Point, those stations in EAS who are designated as the stations that are monitored by other station's EAS receivers and are therefore able to generate a EAS alert.

CAP - Common Alerting Protocol, the Internet-based methodology by which the Federal Emergency Management Agency creates and disseminates EAS alerts across multiple platforms (radio, television, NOAA radio).

Wx - Industry abbreviation for "weather information".

Glad to help out even as this thread heads off down yet another sidetrack.
 
K.M. Richards said:
I'm still scratching my head about the "11/9/11" reference -- I think he is trying to refer to the horrendous events of September 11, 2001 but I can't really be sure -- but I'll be happy to provide the glossary he didn't:

EAS - Emergency Alert System, the present incarnation of what started as Conelrad and was later EBS (Emergency Broadcast System)/EANS (Emergency Alert Notification System).

PEP - Primary Entry Point, those stations in EAS who are designated as the stations that are monitored by other station's EAS receivers and are therefore able to generate a EAS alert.

CAP - Common Alerting Protocol, the Internet-based methodology by which the Federal Emergency Management Agency creates and disseminates EAS alerts across multiple platforms (radio, television, NOAA radio).

Wx - Industry abbreviation for "weather information".

Glad to help out even as this thread heads off down yet another sidetrack.
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I'm kinda relieved actually; I thought he was getting ready to PEP a CAP in my EAS. (That really smarts!!)
 
Ravens said:
And Dr. Drew started in radio. Loveline was around way before his TV stuff. KABC brought him in because he's a brand name and he'll probably do a good show.
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Unfortunately, putting him on KABC will not be a good test of non-political talk, as KABC does not have a competitive signal.
 
mendotatech said:
How many PEP's would have to be created on FM just to be able to have such a broad coverage AM PEP's have given most of the nation. From my perspective, I think AM stations provide a backbone where government dials confidential phone numbers to call the PEP to initiate a national alert.
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While in a few markets, AM stations do cover better than all FMs, that is not true in most of the US.

In fact, a large part of the reason why FM overtook AM in the 70's is that the AMs in most markets do not cover as well as the FMs. In many large markets, there is no AM covering all of the market day and night while in those same markets multiple FMs do give full market coverage.

The only time AM excels in coverage is at night, but we can't program emergencies to happen only after sunset.
 
DavidEduardo said:

Today, Millenials and Gen X listeners don't care so much about jocks because they have other sources for social engagement and for information about everything from artists to the weather.
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I would say they actually hate jocks. But they love Pandora and Youtube, and Youtube to mp3 and listening to their playlists on smartphones. Even if it means listening through that horrible little speaker that often sounds worse than AM ever has.

Gen Xers are getting pretty old at this point. If they have on options to get the smartphone on to better speakers, they will turn on the radio.
 
Goat Rodeo Cowboy said:


I don't know if I am just plain stupid this morning.... just plain lazy.... or a common combination of both.

You are taking something for granted. You assume we all know what EAS, PEP, CAP and Wx mean.

Let me borrow a phrase Rush used a lot in the early days: Maybe I'm from Loma Linda so you'll have to 'splain it to me.
Click to expand...

All I'm saying is that the Emergency Alert System has relied on not just Telephone, but the AM stations that cover most of the nation. Imagine how many Primary Entry Points the FCC will have to support in FM to meet just about the same coverage that a smaller group of AM Stations can support. From a safety standpoint, AM may just end up being there always. Even if (lets hope it doesn't) the AM band is restricted to 640 and 1240 just to have that nationwide coverage should the Common Alerting Protocol (EAS over the Internet) and Weather Radio fail. I don't think the whole band is going away and if it is it is just stupid out of the reason that no station will ever have the coverage that AMs have now to cover the nation in an Emergency.
 
mendotatech said:
I don't think the whole band is going away and if it is it is just stupid out of the reason that no station will ever have the coverage that AMs have now to cover the nation in an Emergency.
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Which is probably what someone in the Media Bureau said (through the chain of command) to the FCC Commissioners who were proposing giving away translators to AM licensees.
 
mendotatech said:
I don't think the whole band is going away and if it is it is just stupid out of the reason that no station will ever have the coverage that AMs have now to cover the nation in an Emergency.
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How many national emergencies has America had since KDKA broadcast the election results in 1920 that required the activation of the emergency system?
 
TheBigA said:
That's not the point.
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It goes to the point that keeping the antiquated AM broadcast network up and running because maybe someday there might be an emergency situation when we'll need it, even though the number of people with AM radios that actually work might not be very many people, is a very lame reason for keeping the AM band alive.

And, just as an FYI, there are no longer many Americans trained in semaphore or Morse code. In case you wanted a back-up system if radio failed that relied on semaphore or Morse code.
 
Avid Listener said:
It goes to the point that keeping the antiquated AM broadcast network up and running because maybe someday there might be an emergency situation when we'll need it,
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Next time you speak with your Congressman, tell him your views. Until then, radio owners and the FCC must follow the law as it was written. We have no choice.
 
TheBigA said:
Next time you speak with your Congressman, tell him your views. Until then, radio owners and the FCC must follow the law as it was written. We have no choice.
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What the hell are you talking about?
 
In a discussion of changing the law regarding the AM broadcast band to abolish it, which would mean repealing the various rules as they were written concerning the use of the AM broadcast band, TheBigA wrote:

TheBigA said:
Next time you speak with your Congressman, tell him your views. Until then, radio owners and the FCC must follow the law as it was written. We have no choice.
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I asked him what obeying the current laws have to do with Congress changing the laws to abolish the AM broadcast band, and he said this:

TheBigA said:
Read posts #432, 435, and 441 in this thread. Then study broadcast law for a couple years.
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These are the three posts.

mendotatech said:
Let's not forget about how it would affect the effectiveness of EAS.

How many PEP's would have to be created on FM just to be able to have such a broad coverage AM PEP's have given most of the nation. From my perspective, I think AM stations provide a backbone (11/9/11 being an exception) where government dials confidential phone numbers to call the PEP to initiate a national alert. CAP and Wx Radio could replace it. But I thought the FCC would have wanted a strong AM/FM presence to serve as a PEP.
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K.M. Richards said:
I'm still scratching my head about the "11/9/11" reference -- I think he is trying to refer to the horrendous events of September 11, 2001 but I can't really be sure -- but I'll be happy to provide the glossary he didn't:

EAS - Emergency Alert System, the present incarnation of what started as Conelrad and was later EBS (Emergency Broadcast System)/EANS (Emergency Alert Notification System).

PEP - Primary Entry Point, those stations in EAS who are designated as the stations that are monitored by other station's EAS receivers and are therefore able to generate a EAS alert.

CAP - Common Alerting Protocol, the Internet-based methodology by which the Federal Emergency Management Agency creates and disseminates EAS alerts across multiple platforms (radio, television, NOAA radio).

Wx - Industry abbreviation for "weather information".

Glad to help out even as this thread heads off down yet another sidetrack.
Click to expand...

mendotatech said:
All I'm saying is that the Emergency Alert System has relied on not just Telephone, but the AM stations that cover most of the nation. Imagine how many Primary Entry Points the FCC will have to support in FM to meet just about the same coverage that a smaller group of AM Stations can support. From a safety standpoint, AM may just end up being there always. Even if (lets hope it doesn't) the AM band is restricted to 640 and 1240 just to have that nationwide coverage should the Common Alerting Protocol (EAS over the Internet) and Weather Radio fail. I don't think the whole band is going away and if it is it is just stupid out of the reason that no station will ever have the coverage that AMs have now to cover the nation in an Emergency.
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Those three posts all pertain to the current status quo. What do those three posts have to do with a discussion of whether or not Congress should change the status quo? Why does anyone need to study broadcast law for a few years to know that if the law is changed, then the old status quo will go away.

Who is suggesting that anyone should disobey the law before the law is repealed? Who even implied such a thing? Yes, there is an emergency alert system in place that would use the AM broadcast band and have the government commandeer commercial broadcasting equipment for dealing with whatever national emergency emerges. That's all theoretical, since it hasn't ever really happened before, at least not in a way that mattered. At no point in America's history since the first commercial radio broadcasts has any emergency alert system that's based on the government taking over commercial radio equipment on the AM band ever made a difference in the outcome of the emergency. So, since we're discussing making a change to the current laws, what the hell does your comment about radio owners and the FCC having to follow the current law have to do with the discussion? And how are those three prior posts about the current status quo supposed to explain an admonishment to follow the law when no one is suggesting that anyone shouldn't follow the law?

Have you been buying smoking materials legally in Colorado?
 
Avid Listener said:
Those three posts all pertain to the current status quo. What do those three posts have to do with a discussion of whether or not Congress should change the status quo? Why does anyone need to study broadcast law for a few years to know that if the law is changed, then the old status quo will go away.
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This happens to be part of the law that won't change. How do I know this? Because it is the entire foundation on which the American system of broadcasting is based. The Congress simply has no appetite for even considering that kind of change in the law. If they had, they might have broached it 15 years ago. They didn't. And they never will. That's why you should at least READ the law before you talk about wanting to abolish or change it. If you just took the time to read it, you'd realize the context of the discussion you're trying to have.
 
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Avid Listener said:
It goes to the point that keeping the antiquated AM broadcast network up and running because maybe someday there might be an emergency situation when we'll need it, even though the number of people with AM radios that actually work might not be very many people, is a very lame reason for keeping the AM band alive.
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The point being made, I believe, is that the primary EAS stations tend to be the big signal AMs when those exist in a market. To trigger an all-station EAS alert, the primary station has to originate the alert. In fact, even if nobody is listening to the primary station, the alert on its signal causes all other stations to relay the message. And that is where the AMs come in.
 
Avid Listener said:
How many national emergencies has America had since KDKA broadcast the election results in 1920 that required the activation of the emergency system?
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There was no emerency system until CONELRAD in the mid to late 50's.

Given the technology of the time and the purpose of the system, CONELRAD worked. Its only intent was to alert and broadcast information in the event of a nuclear attack; even the system of alternating thousands of stations on just two frequencies was designed to avoid radio direction finding by Russian missles.

As that threat lessened post the Cuban Missle Crisis, it was decided that the nation needed not just a nuclear warfare alert but also a system to warn about tornados, floods and such. That was the EBS system, and it was quite state of the art at the time.

As the EBS system aged, the EAS system was created. It is flexible enough to be used for very localized events such as child abductions and such. EAS is not just an OTA radio system, as it can be successfully used by OTA TV, cable and even cellular phones.

It's important to note that the EAS does not activate for events like 9/11, earthquakes, etc. since it's an early warning system, not an after-the-fact advisory.
 
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