K-Love vs. Air 1

Educational Media Foundation, which owns more than 100 FM stations, some in large and medium markets, programs two national formats: K-Love and Air 1, both with DJs hosting the various dayparts. So what makes EMF decide when starting a station whether it will get K-Love or Air 1?

I believe K-Love is more Christian Hot AC, while Air 1 is more Christian Contemporary/Rock? They're a non-profit and all their stations have no commercials, only the national feed. Do they even do local news, traffic or weather? Do they do a local public affairs show or PSAs? Can you fulfill your license requirements if you're satellite 24/7?

It seems K-Love is the favored format, with many more outlets than Air 1. But in a market like Portland ME, they decided to go with Air 1 on a full power station just north of Portland and on a 2000 watt station south of Portland that also hits the Portsmouth NH market.

In Philadelphia they already had a 1000 watt station in nearby Cherry Hill NJ carrying K-Love on 89.5. Then EMF bought full-power 106.9 when Merlin decided to sell. So does 106.9 now run K-Love and 89.5 has Air 1?

The vastly more successful Christian AC format of KLOVE is EMF's first priority and the format that started EMF. Christian AC's have shown the most success commercially and non commercial as well. While KLOVE has a livelier format that Christian AC of the past that is just how AC has evolved overall for the radio industry. Air One is a Christian adult top 40 station/hot ac that is the closest to CHR that really has shown any non commercial success. Its gotten to the point when WAY FM started as rock and is now AC that the Christian CHR chart had to evolve into the Christian HOT AC that a true CHR station would not even touch a number of songs on that chart. The only real CHR's are on HD2 in South Carolina and Houston and the new Boost in St Louis is rhythmic CHR. Any other station claiming to be chr sounds like Air 1. EMF bought Air 1 so it did not start it. I would say klove the main priority but if the market has a strong Christian AC then EMF will put Air 1.

You forgot KVRK in Dallas, Hot 95.9 and "The Rock" in Orlando. There are additional examples around the country. I agree that WAY-FM sold out, went lukewarm. Once - I did whatever it took to DX WAY-FM from Central Florida, whether it was on 88.7 from Ft. Meyers or 88.1 from West Palm Beach. Now, it wouldn't be worth the effort. I would classify what passes as "CCM" these days as praise and worship. We fought the Nashville record companies on that, spending our own money on Christian rock CD's at Long's Christian bookstore in Orlando. We would take our DJ's down there and spend hours auditing music for songs that fit the format. If you want to talk about commercial success - we out rated the local top-40 station in our time slot, and the DJ at the top-40 station played our show on his monitor! Our phones lit up the moment we hit the air. We sponsored concerts on the beach with thousands in attendance - while Eric Clapton only attracted a couple of hundred. So don't tell me that Christian rock, done right, can't attract ratings!

I am very grateful for Air-1 in Houston, breaking the praise and worship stranglehold that KSBJ has held over the area. They finally put NGEN on the air, a creative breath of fresh air in the stagnant and irrelevant CCM radio market. I have NEVER found a single teenager or young professional that preferentially listens to KSBJ's praise and worship main channel, but plenty that listen to NGEN and Air-1. I've introduced dozens of kids to NGEN and Air-1, and they start from a position of NEVER listening to Christian radio to one of giving it a try, putting it on presets, even getting hooked on songs. Since this is the EXACT demographic that secular top-40 stations covet - the rich, affluent, mall rats - I don't think you can say they won't support Christian radio, if it comes anywhere close to programming something other than praise and worship Christian elevator music, which is where CCM has been mired since the early to mid 90's. Praise and worship style CCM may be safe, and parents pay for it because it makes them think they are reaching their kids - I guarantee it isn't reaching kids. Since those kids are the future not only of Christian radio but the church as a whole - you abandon them you are cutting off future financial support. Christian radio without a future audience will become as irrelevant as most AM stations, and whither and die. That is NOT a valid business plan. Ramping up the tempo of CCM right now, as much as soccer moms can stand, IS a better business plans because when the kids turn 11, 12, and 13 they won't be turning off Christian radio in favor of top-40, hip-hop, and whatever other perversion the world has to offer. They are sneaky - even parents who forbid it have no control thanks to earbuds, closed doors, and visits with friends.

Seriously? Christian elevator music?

This is someone who never heard BBN or WMUU online (as opposed to the talk radio station hanging on to the WMUU call letters). Great stuff.

If people want to reach kids that's fine. Just don't tell me about it and keep this sort of thing out of my church on Sunday morning at 11.

vchimpanzee said:

Seriously? Christian elevator music?

This is someone who never heard BBN or WMUU online (as opposed to the talk radio station hanging on to the WMUU call letters). Great stuff.

If people want to reach kids that's fine. Just don't tell me about it and keep this sort of thing out of my church on Sunday morning at 11.

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I've heard BBN and Moody. I changed the station. Music is WAY too boring for my taste.

Since the forum is about Christian broadcasting, and I was a Christian broadcaster, I feel perfectly justified in posting about Christian rock programming on the radio. If you don't personally like Christian rock music, that is your right. But you do not have the right to tell other people not to talk about it. Just move on to the next post. The existence of Christian rock music, its fans, and its ministry to young people is absolutely no threat to you.

As for keeping it out of your church - if your church decides to have it in the worship service and it bothers you, find a church more to your liking. There are churches on every corner to suit every taste.

rbrucecarter5 said:

But you do not have the right to tell other people not to talk about it.

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Sorry, I worded that wrong. Obviously, if I read it, then I'm doing exactly what I said I didn't want to do. It was a general comment meant to refer to how I would feel if I never went to a place like this.

rbrucecarter5 said:

The existence of Christian rock music, its fans, and its ministry to young people is absolutely no threat to you.

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I wish I could say that

rbrucecarter5 said:

As for keeping it out of your church - if your church decides to have it in the worship service and it bothers you, find a church more to your liking. There are churches on every corner to suit every taste.

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I just don't want to change churches.

vchimpanzee said:

I wish I could say that

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Why would the existance of Christian rock music, its fans, and its ministry to young people be any sort of threat to you? Since you obviously don't like, don't listen to it, and avoid it - it doesn't affect your life in any way. Any more than hymns and preaching stations affect my life. When I am in a region that only has that type of station on the air, I simply don't listen to Christian radio at all - with streaming it is less and less of an issue. I would prefer over the air, and feel sorry for young people with no over the air Christian radio they can listen to - but that is the extent of my feelings about hymns, praise and worship, and preaching style radio. I would flip them if I got control of them, which I suppose could be threatening, certainly you would flip Christian rock stations if you got control of them. But for both of us - that will never happen. And - neither of us are in, or ever will be in, a position to "take down" or change the ministry of Christian rock, or the ministry of praise and worship, hymns, and preaching radio. Personally, I am glad hymns, praise and worship, and preaching stations are there for people like you that need them. I would hope that as you grow in Christ, some day you could be equally glad that Christian rock stations are there for people like me, and young people, that are reached by them.

As for changing churches - it was just a suggestion. When one of those conservative churches near me started with the gossip because I let my daughter have the biggest bedroom in my house for her play room, I was dusting my feet on the way out so fast it made my head spin. Ed Young Jr.s Fellowship church had a sermon on gossip in the church the next Sunday. If that wasn't God talking I don't know what would be. When a church in Houston started in on a personal friend of mine because she starred in Wizards of Waverly Place (how can a Christian star in a tv show about wizards) - they didn't know we knew her. I told them I will compare her walk with the Lord by any standard - prayer time, church attendance, scriptures memorized - and I started to dial her up right there on the spot. They backed down really FAST! Cowards retreat when confronted with the truth. Bet they weren't expecting to ever meet someone who knew her! I was out of that church, too, the next week. Lakewood is a lot better anyway. Maybe you got friends and feel you can't leave, but if they are putting Christian rock music into the service and upsetting you - are they really friends? Or is it God moving you in a different direction? Changing churches isn't being wishy washy or double minded. There are so many nuances of personal taste in worship - and that is the reason for a slightly different church on every corner. One lets you down, its OK. You haven't failed, God hasn't failed. Just keep seeking and you will find. Just my two cents worth, from somebody who used to stick around when God was clearly saying "move on".

rbrucecarter5 said:

but if they are putting Christian rock music into the service and upsetting you - are they really friends? Or is it God moving you in a different direction? Changing churches isn't being wishy washy or double minded. There are so many nuances of personal taste in worship - and that is the reason for a slightly different church on every corner. One lets you down, its OK. You haven't failed, God hasn't failed. Just keep seeking and you will find. Just my two cents worth, from somebody who used to stick around when God was clearly saying "move on".

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What they are putting in the worship service is what you would call boring praise and worship music, but at that loud a volume it might as well be rock.

I have gone to this church for more than twenty years and my grandparents went there for as many years before that as I have been there since they were no longer able to attend.

Still, I don't have much of a relationship with those who are supporting new music and wouldn't mind leaving them. One of the worst offenders (she has put together the group that sings on the fourth Sundays) has been really nice to me but she doesn't know how I feel.

I have a hard time with new experiences and I have tried several churches but they all have the problem to some degree, or other problems that would make me not want to go there regularly.

My apologies for the tangent.

Vchimp...are you saying that the issue is volume, not style or content? Perhaps you should open up to the person you consider to be one of the worst offenders. Might help you to get a better understanding of her side of the issue? For that matter, is there a different service time at your church that might be more to your taste?

For those who dislike the loud songs and believes that God isn't pleased with them, please consider these Verses from His Word.

Pay close attention to the fourth, fifth and sixth one.

Psalm 98
King James Version (KJV)

98 O sing unto the Lord a new song; for he hath done marvellous things: his right hand, and his holy arm, hath gotten him the victory.
2 The Lord hath made known his salvation: his righteousness hath he openly shewed in the sight of the heathen.
3 He hath remembered his mercy and his truth toward the house of Israel: all the ends of the earth have seen the salvation of our God.
4 Make a joyful noise unto the Lord, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise.
5 Sing unto the Lord with the harp; with the harp, and the voice of a psalm.
6 With trumpets and sound of cornet make a joyful noise before the Lord, the King.
7 Let the sea roar, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.
8 Let the floods clap their hands: let the hills be joyful together
9 Before the Lord; for he cometh to judge the earth: with righteousness shall he judge the world, and the people with equity.

Dan <><

P.S. After I read them, I discovered that God supports, loves and endorses the louder sounding tunes too.

vchimpanzee said:

but at that loud a volume it might as well be rock.

One of the worst offenders (she has put together the group that sings on the fourth Sundays) has been really nice to me but she doesn't know how I feel.

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If the main issue is the volume, I have a simple solution. After many years of attending and sponsoring Christian rock concerts, you would think I would have appreciable hearing loss. But I do not - because I always use ear plugs. You can pick up a 20 pack at the drug store for under $2. I recommend the foam type and not the wax type. They attenuate the volume by at least 30 dB. I find that I can walk anywhere in the venue and not be uncomfortable, even right in front of the speakers.

I do not personally believe it is necessary for these bands to crank up the volume like that. But for the average concert goer - it is part of the experience and not something that they enjoy. I suppose occasional concerts won't cause permanent damage, but it is a concern. Those little ear buds people use with MP3 players are much more of a danger, because exposure is constant.

As for being stuck in a church - I see people like that all the time. They take the abuse, they take the heresy, they take the gossip - whatever it is that is inappropriate. It is a cultural thing, their friends are there, they don't like what goes on, but like you they are not willing to make a move. I am a person of action - somebody treats me wrong, I am GONE. The woman that is nice to you - that should be a clue as to her spiritual condition. I bet if you reach out to her, you might have an impact. Perhaps your church could do the "dual services" thing - have traditional for you, have contemporary for the young folks. That concept works very well in most churches.

One thing, though, reach out at an appropriate time. We radio people between gigs tend to do similar jobs in the church like do sound boards. I had a woman virtually yank me out of the sound booth and complain that it was too loud for her kid. Naturally, because I wasn't at the post, the equipment quit playing. I reprimanded her for inappropriate behavior - making a sound technician leave their post, and told her about ear plugs. The poor kid had full cuff hearing protectors the next week - not as effective and caused the other kids to make fun of him. Personally - I was surprised she brought him back. Sometimes - God grows a church on by subtraction - subtracting people that are disruptive. I don't mean that in a sinister way, they just go somewhere more to their liking.

Stevens said:

My apologies for the tangent.

Vchimp...are you saying that the issue is volume, not style or content? Perhaps you should open up to the person you consider to be one of the worst offenders. Might help you to get a better understanding of her side of the issue? For that matter, is there a different service time at your church that might be more to your taste?

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No, on the fourth Sunday it is definitely the style, as I heard them practice one day. And next Sunday we have a "praise band" coming from the local college. So I won't be around. But we're having a lunch afterward, so after I go where I'm going, I have to guess what time to go there. What concerns me is that the praise band will still be playing when I get back.

This morning it was the volume. I was in a Sunday School classroom and the volume was respectable. Each time someone would open a door, though, the volume bothered me. We sure have a lot of people getting up to go to the restroom. But the CD for the song the one group was doing would defintely have been "elevator music", by anyone's definition. Once I heard a CD was being used, I made sure not to be in the room. With the style they use on the fourth Sunday, I could hear it in the parking lot. Now at the church I plan to go to next Sunday, I made sure to be gone when they were singing with a CD, but when I listened at the front door, I couldn't hear anything. One difference is that at that church, there is a door inside as well, which isn't the case at my church. But even though the sound had to go through two doors, I would say the volume was at a respectable level, even if the musical style wasn't.

Someone else sang along with a Southern gospel CD. Now the musical style would have been acceptable to me, but probably not the volume.

We don't have but one service. A contemporary service was discussed but never went anywhere. The fourth Sunday each month was what they came up with, after an experiment on St. Patrick's Day last year.

R.D.P. said:

For those who dislike the loud songs and believes that God isn't pleased with them, please consider these Verses from His Word.

Pay close attention to the fourth, fifth and sixth one.

Psalm 98
King James Version (KJV)

98 O sing unto the Lord a new song; for he hath done marvellous things: his right hand, and his holy arm, hath gotten him the victory.
2 The Lord hath made known his salvation: his righteousness hath he openly shewed in the sight of the heathen.
3 He hath remembered his mercy and his truth toward the house of Israel: all the ends of the earth have seen the salvation of our God.
4 Make a joyful noise unto the Lord, all the earth: make a loud noise, and rejoice, and sing praise.
5 Sing unto the Lord with the harp; with the harp, and the voice of a psalm.
6 With trumpets and sound of cornet make a joyful noise before the Lord, the King.
7 Let the sea roar, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.
8 Let the floods clap their hands: let the hills be joyful together
9 Before the Lord; for he cometh to judge the earth: with righteousness shall he judge the world, and the people with equity.

Dan <><

P.S. After I read them, I discovered that God supports, loves and endorses the louder sounding tunes too.

Click to expand...

The only thing this argument does is make me resent the attitude "if God approves, it must be all right".

Well sir, God does indeed support and love loud music.

Here are some other Bible Verses to prove it.

Dan <><

2 Praise the LORD with harp: sing unto him with the psaltery and an instrument of ten strings. 3 Sing unto him a new song; play skillfully with a loud noise. Psalms 33 Verses 2 and 3 (KJV)

1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: praise him in the firmament of his power. 2 Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness. 3 Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp. 4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs. 5 Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals. 6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD. --Psalms 150 (KJV)

And this discussion has strayed about as far from the original post as possible.

The thing you didn't respond to…my idea of you opening up with the person you describe as "one of the worst offenders"…have you talked with her? If not, why not? By your own admission, she appears to be someone who has attempted to reach out to you in a friendly manner. For that matter, have you ever approached your pastor or a music minister or a staff member or someone in eldership about your grievance? Again, if not, why not?

Frankly, I don't understand why you have no trouble opening up about this online to a group of total strangers. We're not in your fellowship. We're not in any position to effect any positive change in addressing this issue at the local level. The persons you need to be talking to about this problem are in your congregation, not on radiodiscussions.com. Clearly you want a place where you can express your frustrations. This is not that place. The leaders at your fellowship are who you need to be talking to.

Several of us have offered possible solutions. It's up to you as to whether or not you follow through on those suggestions. At least to me, it appears more and more that you really don't want any solution. You simply want to complain. But again this isn't the place. You don't complain to McDonalds about a bad meal at Hardees. You don't complain to GM when your Ford quits running.

Let me toss out a personal story, maybe it will help a few of us better understand. My mother-in-law has an extreme hearing loss. She uses hearing aids in both ears. One on one conversation with friends or family is fine. Yet, almost any amplified volume like in most church auditoriums is physically painful to her. Do you also suffer from some sort of hearing issue that makes amplified music so unpleasant?

Stevens - this is the problem Christian rock stations and programmers have been fighting for decades. The nature of the Christian faith is such that it attracts people who want to control other people. Once they become entrenched in positions of authority - they control the type of music played, whether it be traditional or rock - on the radio on in the church. Because they believe they have God on their side, it is logical for them to believe God opposes the same things they oppose. As you can see in other posts, we in the Christian rock broadcast industry can absolutely submarine them with scripture, which is on our side. But they will get on social media and proclaim their musical taste is the only "Holy" and "Spiritual" one, and slam the ministry of any radio station or Christian rock artist that dares to stray from the fold of praise and worship or lukewarm baby formula AC CCM. I also hear this from people who are convinced southern gospel is a one size fits all God's answer to all Christian music. Or people who think the same of hymns. Or whatever their preferred style is. Fortunately, God does not like being placed in our little boxes. He breaks free forcefully and moves in ways we sometimes cannot fathom. Hence the movement away from praise and worship towards Hot Christian AC. When God moves, you better get on board or be "left behind". Christian radio was left behind decades ago now. It went "safe", and became completely irrelevant to the young adult and teen markets - the very demographics coveted most by advertisers, and the future of the Christian faith. Sorry to be negative on Christian radio, but they did it to themselves. Christian soccer moms might like it, but their kids are all on top-40, country, and hip-hop when they hit 12 years old, and will stay with those tastes when they are adults. Not a good long term business model to program to soccer moms and only soccer moms. "Safe for the family" is code word for "safe for 0 to 12, and 30 up. 12 to 29 get lost we don't care about you."

Maybe we can get this thread back to K-Love and Air1 after all…

R Bruce, - I've read about your past in Central Florida, and from my personal experience years ago doing a Christian rock show I can understand some of that pain. For me it was "too many chiefs" with little or no radio background from the local churches financing the show who all wanted to tell me how to program the show. I had to choose to ignore much of the noise and instead follow what I believed was God's leading for the show.

God blessed that with IIRC 18-34 demo numbers that placed the show at number 6 in a 30 plus station market - on a 3,000 watt class A FM against larger commercially supported mainstream 50,000 watt class B FM signals. One of the best compliments paid was when one of the hosts of the market's top rated weekday morning show publicly expressed his support for the sound of the show, despite his not being a fan of Christian radio or music. God was faithful.

Now for me, right or wrong, the stress of the constant pressure to conform the show to what the backers wanted eventually led me to resign. The host that followed was extremely talented and more than capable but also chose to more closely follow what the backers wanted. People continued to be impacted. Yet the numbers were never quite as good. And sadly, the experience left me skeptical about Christian music radio.

But…years later and the market now has three full time 24/7 Christian music radio stations and one 50,000 watt class B FM Moody teaching station. Two of those music stations target 18-34 - one is an Air1 affiliate. Both K-Love and Air1 now host their morning shows from the market. They have a talented support staff working in the market to provide content to their regional affiliates and to the network itself. The Moody station feeds a small regional network of affiliates. Despite the difficulties, it was the experience of the faithful workers at that small class A FM that broke ground for what God has blessed in that market. God is faithful.

Where we differ is in the opinion that Christian music radio was left behind years ago. I see phenomenal growth. That precious ground breaking class A FM struggled at times to find one share point of 12+ audience. The FMs that followed have at times found themselves with top numbers in some demos…full time, not just on Saturday night or in a weekday day part. People are being reached, being impacted for the body of Christ. And it's in more than just my home market. Look at K-Love's outreach nationally. Years ago, could you have ever imagined that a full market signal would be programming Christian music full time in a liberal east coast city like Philadelphia?

For the most part, my radio background is in mainstream AC and Oldies formats. As such, perhaps I have less trouble with the idea of programming to an adult audience. But respectfully Bruce, I have to express my personal belief that God is still breaking new ground and growing the outreach of Christian music stations that yes, start by programming to those safe for the family soccer moms. Just like years ago when that one small part time CCM FM broke ground for the three full time CCM stations that stand in its place today. Three CCM stations that 24/7 reach a far wider demographic range than you or I would have ever imagined when we were fighting those painful Christian rock radio show battles "way back when."

Stevens said:

And this discussion has strayed about as far from the original post as possible.

The thing you didn't respond to…my idea of you opening up with the person you describe as "one of the worst offenders"…have you talked with her? If not, why not? By your own admission, she appears to be someone who has attempted to reach out to you in a friendly manner. For that matter, have you ever approached your pastor or a music minister or a staff member or someone in eldership about your grievance? Again, if not, why not?

Frankly, I don't understand why you have no trouble opening up about this online to a group of total strangers. We're not in your fellowship. We're not in any position to effect any positive change in addressing this issue at the local level. The persons you need to be talking to about this problem are in your congregation, not on radiodiscussions.com. Clearly you want a place where you can express your frustrations. This is not that place. The leaders at your fellowship are who you need to be talking to.

Several of us have offered possible solutions. It's up to you as to whether or not you follow through on those suggestions. At least to me, it appears more and more that you really don't want any solution. You simply want to complain. But again this isn't the place. You don't complain to McDonalds about a bad meal at Hardees. You don't complain to GM when your Ford quits running.

Let me toss out a personal story, maybe it will help a few of us better understand. My mother-in-law has an extreme hearing loss. She uses hearing aids in both ears. One on one conversation with friends or family is fine. Yet, almost any amplified volume like in most church auditoriums is physically painful to her. Do you also suffer from some sort of hearing issue that makes amplified music so unpleasant?

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I've been doing this for ten years now. I sent snail mail to a TV network to complain about one of their shows. they referred me to a web site that was like this one. Whether anyone who can actually do anything ever read what I said, I've been complaining online about things for the past ten years and it makes me feel better, especially if I'm one of many who feel the same way.

No, I can't make anything happen at my church. Either they will get mad or I will. And if I get that mad, I will be gone. As long as the offenders don't hear my complaints, I can pretend that things are all right except when they aren't and I can either go to another church that one Sunday or go outside for duration of the crisis. The woman in charge of music at my church doesn't like it but she can't do anything about it. I don't know how old she is but she must be close to retirement age and when she goes, then what? She may be the one reason the music is still traditional most of the time. Will they even bother to go out and find a new organist? I started to say choir director but the choir has pretty much fallen apart.

And regardless of what the rest of you say, the music I like is what is right for me, and I don't want anyone trying to tell me to like anything different. I will read what the rest of you say because it can be interesting, but I also read about whether Nirvana and Metallica belong with Foster the People and the Avett Brothers or whether Taylor Swift should be on the same radio station as Merle Haggard.

I did complain anonymously to the pastor but he didn't really understand the problem because he was new (I did the same thing with a previous pastor and she gave me the "God approves so it must be all right" attitude and I pretty much said she'd never see me in the sanctuary again during one of those performances, and that has been the case). The new pastor was nicer but refused to continue the discussion until I identified myself, which I wouldn't. But it did make me feel better.

rbrucecarter5 said:

But they will get on social media and proclaim their musical taste is the only "Holy" and "Spiritual" one, and slam the ministry of any radio station or Christian rock artist that dares to stray from the fold of praise and worship or lukewarm baby formula AC CCM. I also hear this from people who are convinced southern gospel is a one size fits all God's answer to all Christian music. Or people who think the same of hymns. Or whatever their preferred style is. Fortunately, God does not like being placed in our little boxes. He breaks free forcefully and moves in ways we sometimes cannot fathom. Hence the movement away from praise and worship towards Hot Christian AC. When God moves, you better get on board or be "left behind". Christian radio was left behind decades ago now. It went "safe", and became completely irrelevant to the young adult and teen markets - the very demographics coveted most by advertisers, and the future of the Christian faith. Sorry to be negative on Christian radio, but they did it to themselves. Christian soccer moms might like it, but their kids are all on top-40, country, and hip-hop when they hit 12 years old, and will stay with those tastes when they are adults. Not a good long term business model to program to soccer moms and only soccer moms. "Safe for the family" is code word for "safe for 0 to 12, and 30 up. 12 to 29 get lost we don't care about you."

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I'm not criticizing anyone and I'm not saying young people don't need to be reached. But this music isn't safe for me. Some Southern gospel is okay but otherwise it has to be the same old hymns or at least new hymns that sound good.

BBN is not all music and WMUU is online and not particuarly acccessible, though I almost never listened at night when they were sacred anyway. But I don't actually listen that much anyway.

vchimpanzee said:

No, I can't make anything happen at my church…

As long as the offenders don't hear my complaints, I can pretend that things are all right…

I don't want anyone trying to tell me to like anything different…

I did complain anonymously to the pastor but he didn't really understand the problem…

The new pastor was nicer but refused to continue the discussion until I identified myself...

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Think about what you're writing. Sadly, all I see is a person who has somehow convinced himself that living in such distress is the only way to survive in - of all places - a church fellowship. And I suspect that if you truly wanted to "pretend that things are all right," you wouldn't be complaining to us either.

I don't know what anyone else can say other than to express a concern about how terribly unpleasant your life must be most Sunday mornings. No one has to live that way, unless you choose to do so. And why someone would choose that seems beyond comprehension.

For me, it's time to shake some dust off my feet. Where's that ignore list…