BSI Simian Question for the Gurus

We use BSI Simian for mostly Satellite Automation (For which it excels) and live dayparts for playback of music and commercials (for which it is alright). We are playing with the idea of using the Voicetrack Feature to extend local dayparts while saving wear and tear on the staff (read that as me and three others watching three stations). During the live Dayparts we can delete unneeded content to keep the log on time. During satellite hours there are "Time Immediate" Log Update events keeping the log on time. These almost never affect the log but are insurance against the Satellite Service missing a local avail trigger.

Now that you have the background I need to know- if it will, and how- to update the position in the log based on scheduled time, in the event we fall behind in the schedule. Essentially, I want the Simian to update the next to play event based on time short of interupting the current event. The Backtiming Feature is out for a couple of reasons: 1. It requires a ASI audio card, which we don't have, to function and 2. it uses pitching (+ or - up to 4%) to shorten or lengthen the playback time of the log. Yech!!

There is absolutley no plans to upgrade this automation. We've managed to make it do some pretty amazing stunts but this is something I haven't been able to figure out how to do.

Any suggestions out there in Engineering Land?

Not sure exactly what you have in mind, but this is one trick I use on Simian;

I've used a "phantom" event to reset the "clock" (that is, getting the system in sync for the next satellite break in the rotation). By"clock" I mean the hour formatting aka old top 40 days where you always came out of the news with a hit, ran two songs, then spots etc. Mot the tickety-tock kind.

The "phantom event" is 10 seconds of silence, which I schedule to run two minutes past the top of the hour on our classic rock satellite format (using the precise time command). (we run satellite through an external mixer, so there must be a command to turn satellite on/off, not like some system which run it through the sound card That way, in case the satellite screws up and skips a break in the previous hour (which they do every so often) the "clock" is reset to the top by the phantom break, thus automatically queing up the optional break at 20: past.

No Problem keeping the Satellite Hours on time. I want to keep MOHD/VT Hours on time. I Use a similar trick for satellite Automation.

> Not sure exactly what you have in mind, but this is one
> trick I use on Simian;
>
> I've used a "phantom" event to reset the "clock" (that is,
> getting the system in sync for the next satellite break in
> the rotation). By"clock" I mean the hour formatting aka old
> top 40 days where you always came out of the news with a
> hit, ran two songs, then spots etc. Mot the tickety-tock
> kind.
>
> The "phantom event" is 10 seconds of silence, which I
> schedule to run two minutes past the top of the hour on our
> classic rock satellite format (using the precise time
> command). (we run satellite through an external mixer, so
> there must be a command to turn satellite on/off, not like
> some system which run it through the sound card That way,
> in case the satellite screws up and skips a break in the
> previous hour (which they do every so often) the "clock" is
> reset to the top by the phantom break, thus automatically
> queing up the optional break at 20: past.
>

OK if I am reading this correctly, you’re asking for a “time update” function which will drop excess songs/events and cue say a stop set at x:xx time(s) throughout the hour. So if say you have a stop set that needs to run at 20 minutes past the hour, and you have say songs x y and z still on the list, you want BSI to essentially drop any of those songs that may run way past 20 minutes after the hour if they actually play.

If this is the case, it sounds to me like you are saying such commands already exist for satellite programming, correct? You just want the same commands during jock-assisted / VT programming?

Sounds like you need to have whoever builds your daily playlist, to put those same commands from satellite programmed hours, into dayparts under jock-assisted / VT times.

I know that On Ai Digital’s UDS system will do all of that, via Breaknote commands. Not being familiar with BSI’s system, I wonder if it also uses Breaknote commands for the same / similar functions. With UDS, if you need such commands in hours they aren’t scheduled, you can manually insert them in the log editor. Perhaps BSI’s system will allow you to do so as well? You just need to know the Breaknote language BSI uses.

Hope that helps…

R

I think I may understand what you are wanting to do and have the answer. I am going to use a Top of Hour Id for an example. Say for instance you overschedule your live daypart hour, or it runs over. If you have a certain top of hour bed, or legal id you play at the top of the hour, you can replace the plus (+) mark for the cue with a pound sign (#). So for instance at 11:00 a.m. you have a legal id scheduled and at 10:58 a.m. there is still 5 or so more songs before it gets to the top of hour. As long as the program log shows scheduled times you can put that pound sign next to a event/song in the program log and when it gets to that time it will automatically move that event/song next. It will leave the current event playing and let it finish, but if you want it to play something at that exact time, you can instead put a (@) mark for the cue.

If that doesn't help, bsi has a user forum that is very helpful, you can post your question and usually several people that has had the same question or problem will help you out. The forum is on their website.

>
> There is absolutley no plans to upgrade this automation.
> We've managed to make it do some pretty amazing stunts but
> this is something I haven't been able to figure out how to
> do.
>
> Any suggestions out there in Engineering Land?
>

I help run a station using Simian with almost 100% automation (just only a few hours of live assist a day)

My recomendation to keep the log on track is to scheduile one of your imagers or liners with a # instead of a +

say you have 5 songs:

14:05 + song
14:07 + song
14:09 + song
14:11 + song

say at :

14:15 # liner
14:16 + song
14:19 + song
14:21 + song
14:23 + song

by # signing the liner at 14:15 this will tell Simian to "jump ahead" to that mark after current playing event if for instance you where running way behind then it will contiune where it left off until the next #

at the station I help with we have a # for the legal ID at the top of hour so if we over fill the hour with songs it always will skip ahead to the legal give or take within a minute or two of the depending on how long the current song playing is..

We also have a promo at 14:20 past the hour that is # so simian "keeps on track"

and since we run usanews break at the bottom of the hour and underwritter spots we go into that break at 14:30 with a # to make sure the news plays close to the bottom of the hour instead of it playing the over scheduled songs.

I hope i made some sense?

<P ID="signature">______________
Lenks
Program Director/Music Director
X Music Online
The X
Today's Best Music
http://www.xmusiconline.com/</P>

Excellent! I had seen in the documentation the cue commands (@+ and #) but no reference to the function of the #. Thanks for the quick response...


> I think I may understand what you are wanting to do and have
> the answer. I am going to use a Top of Hour Id for an
> example. Say for instance you overschedule your live
> daypart hour, or it runs over. If you have a certain top of
> hour bed, or legal id you play at the top of the hour, you
> can replace the plus (+) mark for the cue with a pound sign
> (#). So for instance at 11:00 a.m. you have a legal id
> scheduled and at 10:58 a.m. there is still 5 or so more
> songs before it gets to the top of hour. As long as the
> program log shows scheduled times you can put that pound
> sign next to a event/song in the program log and when it
> gets to that time it will automatically move that event/song
> next. It will leave the current event playing and let it
> finish, but if you want it to play something at that exact
> time, you can instead put a (@) mark for the cue.
>
> If that doesn't help, bsi has a user forum that is very
> helpful, you can post your question and usually several
> people that has had the same question or problem will help
> you out. The forum is on their website.
>

> Any suggestions out there in Engineering Land?

Unrelated, but worth a mention.

The AM station with whom I recently became involved suffers from TONS of dead air. Like every hour. Like 2-3 minutes sometimes. I suggested that they create a 10 minute long donut from the top hour ID bed and throw it at the end of the stopsets...that way Simian will play that loop until the scheduled time is reached, otherwise it'll just skip over it when the timing is correct.

(program stuff here)
Cart with macro for the SS8.2 to mute all but simian
+ spot
+ spot
+ spot
+ spot
+ donut loop here
@ legal id
+ Cart with macro for the SS8.2 to mute all but the news carrier and touch the relay for the DSC
(rest of hour here)<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

There has to be a reason for the shortage. Are there missing spots making it come up short?



> > Any suggestions out there in Engineering Land?
>
> Unrelated, but worth a mention.
>
> The AM station with whom I recently became involved suffers
> from TONS of dead air. Like every hour. Like 2-3 minutes
> sometimes. I suggested that they create a 10 minute long
> donut from the top hour ID bed and throw it at the end of
> the stopsets...that way Simian will play that loop until the
> scheduled time is reached, otherwise it'll just skip over it
> when the timing is correct.
>
> (program stuff here)
> Cart with macro for the SS8.2 to mute all but simian
> + spot
> + spot
> + spot
> + spot
> + donut loop here
> @ legal id
> + Cart with macro for the SS8.2 to mute all but the news
> carrier and touch the relay for the DSC
> (rest of hour here)
>

> There has to be a reason for the shortage. Are there missing
> spots making it come up short?

That's the most common reason...but since it's unattended, not much can be done to remedy it when it happens.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

These guys are right on by instructing you to use the #. What I do is instead of changing one of the existing carts, I ad a REM macro with a # in front of the item I want played next at the update time.

Also like sambuca said, you can use more than one of these an hour. You can put them in every 15 minutes or whatever. That way if you have an hour that's way off it gives the automation more chances to correct itself.

Good Luck!


> Excellent! I had seen in the documentation the cue commands
> (@+ and #) but no reference to the function of the #. Thanks
> for the quick response...
>
>
> > I think I may understand what you are wanting to do and
> have
> > the answer. I am going to use a Top of Hour Id for an
> > example. Say for instance you overschedule your live
> > daypart hour, or it runs over. If you have a certain top
> of
> > hour bed, or legal id you play at the top of the hour, you
>
> > can replace the plus (+) mark for the cue with a pound
> sign
> > (#). So for instance at 11:00 a.m. you have a legal id
> > scheduled and at 10:58 a.m. there is still 5 or so more
> > songs before it gets to the top of hour. As long as the
> > program log shows scheduled times you can put that pound
> > sign next to a event/song in the program log and when it
> > gets to that time it will automatically move that
> event/song
> > next. It will leave the current event playing and let it
> > finish, but if you want it to play something at that exact
>
> > time, you can instead put a (@) mark for the cue.
> >
> > If that doesn't help, bsi has a user forum that is very
> > helpful, you can post your question and usually several
> > people that has had the same question or problem will help
>
> > you out. The forum is on their website.
> >
>

> Any suggestions out there in Engineering Land?

We use the latest version of BSI/Simian on two networked PC's both running Windows XP with the latest service pack. With the exception of a hard drive failure and random hiccups, it's been pretty stable. One of the PC's is in the production studio, the other is in the FM air studio. ALL local content, no satellite, and one CD-syndicated show per week. Weekdays we're live 6a-9a, then we're voicetracked 9a-4p, live 4p-6p, tracked 6p-midnight. Weekends entirely tracked. And it works well 99% of the time. There are quirks you'll have to work through.

We use the Time-Next code to keep it on time. You use a # instead of a + or an @. You overschedule music by a couple songs per hour, and the # will skip songs without stopping the music. However, you will need the @ to start the sat. programming on time, and without backtiming, you will interrupt a song.

I built our Simian system from the ground-up. If you want more help, post your e-mail and I'll e-mail you.

m.k.

we have simian 2.2.1. occasionally our liners don't play coming out of top of hour news and at ends of breaks. also sometimes liners coming out of commercial set are stepping on end of last spot. anyone have this problem? how can it be addressed? thanks.

Unregistered said:

we have simian 2.2.1. occasionally our liners don't play coming out of top of hour news and at ends of breaks. also sometimes liners coming out of commercial set are stepping on end of last spot. anyone have this problem? how can it be addressed? thanks.

Click to expand...

A few things can cause this.

If your return liners are set off by satellite triggers in async deck 4 (read: able to overlap the sat audio), then it could be you're not watching your file lengths. That's the first thing sales and production people have to get over when doing automation... the idea that a "30" can be "29" or "32", or even "30.5". Five spots later, that ".5" has taken you 2 1/2 seconds over where you thought you'd be.. If you're not already doing this, use a file editor (like Audition) to trim each file to exactly :15 :30 or :60 every time. Use the compression-expansion function to fix minor timing errors. If you don't have a spot library where every file is exact, then you're screwed from the start and there's no help for you.

Make sure your audio card will handle multiple streams (simian calls them "decks") and that they are correctly programmed. If not, then your computer will not overlap files, which is sometimes needed to keep things on-time. BSI likes audio cards from Audio Science, and this is one case where I don't mess with company specifications.

When you can do this off-line, take a bunch of (exact) 30-second files... like 6 or 7+, play them back-to-back and see if Simian comes out of the set at exactly the accumulated length of the files. The goal here is to see if your system needs an inordinate amount of time to get from one file to the next. If it's longer, then one explanation is your computer isn't switching as fast as you need it to. For this, try setting the main deck segue (which should be flagged on, by the way) to a small fraction above zero. Advance the number a notch or two until you get the set to line up on time. See the lower right of the window in "Tools/Hardware Options" for this parameter. This is strictly a command timing issue. If you're using an Audio Science card, the process of playing a file is completely handled in the card and needs no CPU resources beyond telling the card what to play.

If that doesn't work, you might try logging your liner as the last entry in the stop set, and run it as a "playasync (liner name)" macro. that will let you start the liner at the end of the last spot without needing to worry about the satellite walking over you. In that case, just make sure your liners aren't so long they walk over the incoming vocals.

In the case where some liners aren't running at all, check to see if the "intro protection" flag is set (see Help/Spyglass Diagnostics/Expert tab). If you uncheck that, it might fix the problem.

In the "Tools/Program Options" tab, I would suggest you flag "event logging", "log triggers" and "log cuts within carts". That can help you trace problems when they do come up.

Some might not believe this, but Simian does not have a mind of its own. There's always an explanation why it won't do something it's supposed to. That said, Simian does have some quirks, and it can sometimes take some "cut and paste" work in the log to make things happen the way you want. Once you get it right, Simian's a good, stable system.

What is supposed to start the liners? Net cues/triggers?

tpt said:

What is supposed to start the liners? Net cues/triggers?

Click to expand...

Actually, they're the same thing. The XDS people call their relay outputs "net cues". Other sat companies just call them relays.

A liner can be fired off automatically by the program service, if it's part of the format, or manually in a log entry.

The relay outputs of your satellite receivers (or computers, or Barix / Comrex boxes, or push buttons at your board) become "triggers" when they're connected to the Simian interface that watches for them. That could be a Broadcast Tools switcher, or a GPIO box. The appropriate relays are matched up with the trigger inputs, then programmed in a "trigger table" to do something in Simian when they're fired off.

If you play a liner manually, you need to decide whether you want to lay the liner over the top of the incoming music or keep the satellite off until the liner's finished. For an overlap, do a macro entry called "playasync (file/cart name)". If you just want the liner to load in a regular deck, you don't use the playasync macro. In that case, it will play, then switch the satellite back on. Place the entry in your log like any other file as the last line of your stop set and set the 'autostart' flag (+).

If your satellite service offers the return liner relay (netcue), wire it to an unused trigger input, then go to the trigger table you use during that show and put the liner file (or cart) name in the trigger line you wired up. That should do it.

Sorry if this got wordie... you didn't say how far along you were.

Good luck!

Uh, I was replying to MK's question on why his ID's and liners sometime come up missing. That is, were his liners triggered externally, or internally by something in his program (a time command, for example, in the case of the ID). Helps to narrow down where the problem might lie....all kinds of things effect Simian's response to a trigger off a satellite receiver (and that's why regular Simian costs more than "Simian Light," which doesn't communicate with the outside world.

I use trigger & net cue interchangeably. Some automation systems use the latter term, some (like Simian) the former. Usually avoids confusion.

tpt said:

Uh, I was replying to MK's question on why his ID's and liners sometime come up missing.

Click to expand...

Uh, OK! Looks like I misread the question.

Is there a way to print to file the List of Music stored in Simian?

I have gone to:
TOOLS
EVENT BUILDER
PRINT

Sill searching for a Print To File option.

Any suggestions?

chuckmcmillan said:

Is there a way to print to file the List of Music stored in Simian?

I have gone to:
TOOLS
EVENT BUILDER
PRINT

Sill searching for a Print To File option.

Any suggestions?

Click to expand...

Install a free PDF printer driver like CutePDF or Bullzip, then print as usual but select the PDF printer you installed.